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MirageDrive Mast (new style) Unscrewed??
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=11995		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  AlohaDan [ Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  MirageDrive Mast (new style) Unscrewed??
About 6-9 months ago I invested in the new screw in masts and sprockets for the Mirage Drive. When I put them on I used blue loctite.

About two months ago I upgraded to the new drums, chain assemblies, and idler cable. This was because I had experienced my third cable failure at swag point.

Yes I do all the maintenance stuff and tension adjustments roadrunner recommends. No cherry here.

So I was flabbergasted last week when pedaling and sailing along I got the no action signal from the drive.

Pulling it the fwd mast had unscrewed itself! I was, repeat, flabbergasted.

So some questions.

1. What would cause the mast to unscrew?

2. And what pressure must have been involved. It take a great deal of effort to even turn the mast in the sail. I have to use vice grips to pull it out.

3. Related to the sail preventing turning, what about the loctite?

Fortunately I wasn't in harms way, and it took about as long to fix as it would have to pull the spare drive out and attach one pedal-crank (you need to remove to be able to store in fwd hatch).

But what if I was in heavy winds trying to get home? Time then becomes a BIG problem.

So I'm worried how this happened. Re 3 questions above.

Aloha

Dan
Author:  Roadrunner [ Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
When you install your new masts, make sure everything is clean and dry and use plenty of Locktite (blue) thread locker. Insert them firmly with a screwdriver -- no need to use the vise grips.


Quote:
Downside? Better not forget to use the Locktite (Blue). It works great as a thread locker and these need to be locked in. If you loosen them for any reason, re-apply new thread locker.


Quote:
They'll unscrew a threaded mast in short order if you forget to use Locktite or some other binder. Try it yourself if you have any doubts. They are relentless!


Dan, this was bound to happen. I'm sorry it had to be you, but the warnings have been there all along. With all the criticism about using too much Locktite and all the whining about the masts being too difficult to unthread, it was just a matter of time until someone didn't take the Locktite issue seriously.

I've been preaching about this repeatedly because it happened to me also -- before I got the picture. Those masts can and will unthread themselves in a NY minute, given half a chance -- even if you really cinch them down. The thing is, if the masts are still inserted but loose, it is not obvious without actually checking them.

Clean and rethread them using PLENTY of Locktite Blue, making sure they are fully seated. How much is plenty? Enough to be forced out the top of the hole and wiped off. Do them one at a time so the Locktite is fresh for each fin and you shouldn't have a problem. If you want more holding power, go to Locktite Red, but beware, you may not be able to remove them again. A third alternative would be Teflon tape, believe it or not. Use enough to make it hard to thread. I tried it for a couple of months successfully, but can't say for sure how it will work in the long term -- I switched to Locktite. 8)

BTW just a reminder, the Drive works fine with one fin. You can make up a lot for the loss of surface area with the higher CPM available. It's always good to be current on your emergency procedures, especially out there!
http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewt ... ht=one+fin :wink:
Author:  AlohaDan [ Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
OK So blue loctite and plenty of it.

Your comment on it drying very fast I have also seen posted elsewhere. Maybe I applied to both at once and then did sequential screw ins. Can't remember, but it is possible.

Yes if it had been in harms way, I would have gone with one fin. I've done it before. Actually feels much easier to pedal and you still get enough power to go at least half speed if not more.

For others, make sure you have a stubby philips , and pliers available to hold the nut. I used my fishing needle nose. Pulling the clevis pin & ring or bolt nut alternative will be a requirement to remove the bum sail from the paddle equation.

On the red loctite. If I can't remove the mast I guess (depending on circumstances) I'm out a mast and and sprocket. That might be a risk to take. Unless I hit something I can't see having to remove the mast. I'll think about that risk some more. I lean to it somewhat versus the risk of being in trouble due to the mast unscrewing.
Author:  AlohaDan [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
While re-insertin the masts :idea:

What is the effect of WD40 on loctite?

Perhaps Hobie engineers could call loctite. They might stand a better chance of getting through.

Note I also observed that the front of the sprocket threads were stripped. Perhaps to rocking around loose?
Author:  kepnutz [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hey Ya'll
Its kinda funny that two years ago after breaking a mast and sprocket I had to defend my use of blue threadlocker around here because it was going to rot away the nylon/plastic sprocket.

http://www.hobiecat.com/community/viewt ... 79&start=0

Nowadays its "just the ticket"for all your drivetrain needs. :lol:

At any rate that blue threadlocker I put on my set screws two years ago is still intact and is preventing the mast from hogging out the nylon sprocket.

All you folks with older style drives may want to put a dab of blue on your mast set screws before the spring/summer kayak season hits full stride here in the northern hemi. 8)
If nothing else then at least check the set screws to make sure they are snug.
Have fun '
Kepnutz
Author:  KayakingBob [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
Kepnutz,

We've been using Locktite on our Mirage drives since you recommended it, and haven't had a single screw back out since. One of many great tips on the forums.

Keep up the good work!

Kayaking Bob
Author:  mmiller [ Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:37 am ]
Post subject: 
I can bet WD-40 will prohibit the loctite for working. The parts should be cleaned first.
Author:  AlohaDan [ Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:52 am ]
Post subject: 
OK I cleaned up both the masts and female holders on the sprockets.

After loading the first mast with loctite and screwing it in checked the second. Yep it was loose too although no threads were visible! Repeated procedure.

I am going to avoid spraying with loctite around this area and watch what happens.

If anyone else experiences this problem please post.
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