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Took down the mast: observations and questions
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Author:  ramstadt [ Mon Nov 24, 2014 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Took down the mast: observations and questions
Needed to transport my H18 to its new home for the next 4 months. So, my wife and I took down the mast for transport. Here are my observations as a newbie:

  • That thing is much heavier than I expected it to be having seen videos on YouTube.
  • I almost forgot to put the pin in at the base of the mast. I am so glad that I didn't.
  • I never realized that when sailing that the base of the mast is actually just floating on a ball. Is there ever a situation where the mast will just fall off the ball?
  • I don't like the life jacket method for keeping the mast off the tiller bar. Where can I get a proper stand for the mast?
  • My halyard hook is the kind with the flapper on it. Can I remove the flapper or should I replace the entire hook? If I remove the flapper, should I just drill out the rivet that is holding on?

Thanks,
Bob
Author:  wscotterwin [ Mon Nov 24, 2014 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
ramstadt wrote:
That thing is much heavier than I expected it to be having seen videos on YouTube.


Yes it is. Many people rig systems that use a winch on the front of your trailer to help raise and lower the mast. Two people are best. I still do it the old fashion way (brute strength) but I am afraid those days are coming to an end. The 20 mast is a back breaker. Mikey at Surf City Catamaran can walk you through it next time you are in Santa Cruz. He has rigged his H20 this way.

ramstadt wrote:
I almost forgot to put the pin in at the base of the mast. I am so glad that I didn't.


I agree, Don't do that!
Also, don't let anyone under the mast (to catch it) before the pin catches and you know the mast won't come down on their head. Think hammer and nail.

ramstadt wrote:
I never realized that when sailing that the base of the mast is actually just floating on a ball. Is there ever a situation where the mast will just fall off the ball?


No. Unless you are rigged impossibly wrong. But, make sure that the bearing is still in good shape and without damage. Sometimes the ball is worn and the screw starts digging into the aluminum base. Masts fall down on boats for multiple reasons. Rigging wear is most common. Check all your wires for rust and fray damage. If even slightly damaged....replace. EVERY boat that I sail on gets new rigging and pins. To me, it's like wearing someone elses underwear.

ramstadt wrote:
I don't like the life jacket method for keeping the mast off the tiller bar. Where can I get a proper stand for the mast?


I have seen so many ways people deal with this. Most suck. Some don't. The system I like was a clamping system not produced anymore. This link following shows one that you mount behind the 18 on your trailer. You can make one as well.

http://www.murrays.com/13-3002.html

ramstadt wrote:
My halyard hook is the kind with the flapper on it. Can I remove the flapper or should I replace the entire hook? If I remove the flapper, should I just drill out the rivet that is holding on?


Drill out the rivet.

Bob,

I am also in Div 3 and will be seeing you next year at the regattas. If not anything else........we will have lots of advise.....and beer....
Check out the following link to see the events in our area. Come see us in Avila (or Lopez depending on water levels) in April.
http://www.div3.hobieclass.com/?ID=7662

Oh yeah, we want pics of your boat. :wink:
Author:  ramstadt [ Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
Thanks!

To raise the mast, I lifted the mast a little and then had my wife use the winch to raise it the rest of the way. I steadied the mast by hand while it was being raised. I've seen pictures of people constructing a pole to get proper angles for the winch to raise from the mast laying all the way down. I can see the appeal to doing that.

Bob
Author:  dorienc [ Mon Nov 24, 2014 6:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
It's called a gin pole. There are several different ways to do it. I made one from a 2x4 20 years ago for my H-17. Now for my Getaway, I bought the factory Mast Stepper III.
I can almost but not quite step my Getaway's mast by hand when the bob is on it. If I have assistance, I will step it by hand to save time. Otherwise, I use the stepper.
Author:  moncasta [ Mon Nov 24, 2014 8:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
Another tip for mast raising can be to have your helper unhook the trapeze handles from either side and pull the mast up with those, same goes for letting it down. You just have to be sure to keep it centered.

One of the H18 guys in our fleet rigged up a modified C-clamp and an electric winch with remote... there are all sorts of solutions.


On the subject of mast holders, the trailer mount is the way to go. Make on yourself if you have the means or buy the one from Murray's. The clamps and stands and such all take awhile to get dialed in, many masts have some nice rub marks from failures.
Author:  ramstadt [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
I ordered the stand from Murray's. It looks like a nice option. The electric winch is an interesting option that I have been considering.

Another question: what is a reliable but fast way to secure the mast to the trailer after I get it down? I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly. I'd like to be able to trailer the various events next summer.

Thanks,
Bob
Author:  moncasta [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
I have used ratcheting straps as well as bungee or just rope. My trailer mount has a hole in it with a piece rope that I cross over the cradle and loop back around the mount and tie it off. The rope can't fall off and get lost, and is easily replaced if/when it wears out.
Author:  SabresfortheCup [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
ramstadt wrote:
I never realized that when sailing that the base of the mast is actually just floating on a ball. Is there ever a situation where the mast will just fall off the ball?


If your rigging is beyond loose, or if you snap a shroud anchor pin/clevis/wire etc, the mast could pop off and fall, but under ordinary sailing conditions, no. The lack of a captive mast base is the reason that the solo upright shroud extender is not intended for the H18. With your rigging that loose, you could easily pop the mast off the base, after which, good luck re-stepping your mast on the water!

Also, if you have the old, "two rivet" style mast base, you may notice that a tiny spacer and philips head screw is the only thing keeping the hemispherical mast bearing in place. I can tell you that screw loosens over time, especially with all the mast rotation. If the screw gets too loose, it can shear off and the mast bearing (and thus the foot of the mast) could "kick out" and come down. The newer "four rivet" mast base is designed to prevent this.

ramstadt wrote:
I don't like the life jacket method for keeping the mast off the tiller bar. Where can I get a proper stand for the mast?


I don't like it either. I use a mast cradle that I bought for trailering. It's not the best solution, since it requires me to take off the rudders when trailering and supports the weight of the mast on the rear crossbar, but it works.

ramstadt wrote:
My halyard hook is the kind with the flapper on it. Can I remove the flapper or should I replace the entire hook? If I remove the flapper, should I just drill out the rivet that is holding on?


I actually don't mind the flapper. The only time I've ever had a problem with it is after a hard day of sailing when I cranked in the downhaul and bent the halyard hook slightly. The flapper got stuck up when I went to drop the sail, then got stuck down the next time I went out, and I had to fiddle with the halyard for a little bit both times to get the ring on/off the hook. Bent it back, and now it works fine again. If you don't like it though, you can just drill out the rivet. I have noticed that the newer halyard hooks are a little deeper, which probably would've prevented mine from bending.
Author:  jim-doty [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
ramstadt wrote:
Another question: what is a reliable but fast way to secure the mast to the trailer after I get it down? I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly.


Like Tom, I also use a piece of rope to secure the mast to the support on the trailer. My latest trailer, I mounted an old cam cleat that I had lying around to the vertical section of the support. Now, after making a few wraps around the mast and cradle, I just run the line through the cam cleat and cinch it down tight. Easy peasey. Then I wrap the excess around the support, just incase.

Jim
Author:  moncasta [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
jim-doty wrote:
ramstadt wrote:
Another question: what is a reliable but fast way to secure the mast to the trailer after I get it down? I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly.


Like Tom, I also use a piece of rope to secure the mast to the support on the trailer. My latest trailer, I mounted an old cam cleat that I had lying around to the vertical section of the support. Now, after making a few wraps around the mast and cradle, I just run the line through the cam cleat and cinch it down tight. Easy peasey. Then I wrap the excess around the support, just incase.

Jim



This may be happening to my trailer soon...
Author:  ramstadt [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
moncasta wrote:
jim-doty wrote:
ramstadt wrote:
Another question: what is a reliable but fast way to secure the mast to the trailer after I get it down? I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly.


Like Tom, I also use a piece of rope to secure the mast to the support on the trailer. My latest trailer, I mounted an old cam cleat that I had lying around to the vertical section of the support. Now, after making a few wraps around the mast and cradle, I just run the line through the cam cleat and cinch it down tight. Easy peasey. Then I wrap the excess around the support, just incase.

Jim



This may be happening to my trailer soon...


I must say that this is a very appealing option.
Author:  tpdavis473 [ Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
It is usually not too expensive to have a removeable rear mast rest added to your trailer by some trailer or muffler shop. Mine was made from some roll bar stock and welded to the frame extending back to around the rudders. The pinned stand is about the same height as the front mast rest and has a roller built in so it is easy to roll the mast back to get it ready to raise. Total cost for me in high priced CA was $350 and included painting. Keeps the mast off the boat parts while trailering and helps raise the mast a little--also gives me something to attach the rear beam to to keep the boat from moving forward when using the trailer winch to winch up the mast.
Author:  srm [ Wed Nov 26, 2014 4:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
ramstadt wrote:
I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly.


I think you will find that as you continue to use your boat more and more, your procedures will continuously be tweaked and improved to make the rigging process more efficient. This is why more experienced sailors are able to rig their boats more quickly and with seemingly less effort than newbies. You see an opportunity to make something go a little more smoothly, you try it out, if it works, it becomes incorporated into the procedure. This is also why everyone tends to tie down and rig their boats a little differently - it's a constantly evolving process.

sm
Author:  tpdavis473 [ Wed Nov 26, 2014 9:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
srm wrote:
ramstadt wrote:
I strongly believe in developing systems to make these procedures go smoothly.


I think you will find that as you continue to use your boat more and more, your procedures will continuously be tweaked and improved to make the rigging process more efficient. This is why more experienced sailors are able to rig their boats more quickly and with seemingly less effort than newbies. You see an opportunity to make something go a little more smoothly, you try it out, if it works, it becomes incorporated into the procedure. This is also why everyone tends to tie down and rig their boats a little differently - it's a constantly evolving process.

sm

Amen! If you rig once a week, there's no drama; if you rig once a year you tend to have problems.
Author:  ramstadt [ Sun Dec 07, 2014 11:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took down the mast: observations and questions
I replaced the standard halyard ring with one from Murrays and now I can hook it and unhook it first try. I didnt bother removing the flap. it doesn't seem to be an issue for me.
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