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snapped side rail and other questions.
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=26133		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  RSPvideo [ Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:  snapped side rail and other questions.
I tried searching and came up empty handed...

My girlfriend gave me my first sailboat (h16) for my birthday and I (read, her dad) is fixing it up. He has done an amazing job with the hulls (he owns an auto-body shop). The next major fix is the side rail. It is snapped right in the middle and has a piece of metal riveted into the top and bottom.
Image

It seams pretty flimsy and I feel like it should either be replaced for fixed. I was thinking about welding it or getting a sheath to put inside the rail and rivet it in. Will either of these work, or should I just replace it?

I also have a new trampoline that I will put on and I ordered a Baby Bob (thought this was a good idea seeing as I'm pretty inexperienced). After that, I think I need to replace most of the lines. I'm sure I will discover more things that need to be fixed once I tackle rigging the boat. That will be interesting...

Check out the before and after shots of the hulls. Pretty amazing!
Before:
Image

After:
Image

edit: not sure why pics don't work, you can see them here: http://picasaweb.google.com/joseph.gaetani/Sailboat?authkey=Gv1sRgCOzEm7T61b6J4gE#
Author:  Jman6631 [ Tue Jun 08, 2010 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
You're a LOT better off replacing it. Welding that aluminum weakens it and makes it brittle and only delay's the replacement. Patching it will never bring it back to its full strength, which you're going to need. I doubt a patch as you're describing it could even withstand the tension of the tramp.

Much more importantly is the affect of that rail's condition while you're underway. A weld or a patch may be doable with the help of your future father-in-law :shock:, but neither will provide the rigidity needed to make her worthy or sail as efficiently as she needs to. Guys work real hard at keeping the frames of their 16s as tight as possible, some going so far as dismantling really loose ones and "gluing" them back together with epoxy, then bolting.

In case you weren't aware, when you tighten your tramp you need to do so tight enough such that the side rails are deflecting inwards ~1". To get that, you use a ratcheting tie down strap or even your main sheet to pull the two sides together before tightening the tramp. That's the tightness you're looking for.

Save the effort and frustration, install a replacement.
Author:  Sail Revolution [ Tue Jun 08, 2010 6:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Jman6631 wrote:
You're a LOT better off replacing it.


I totally agree with Jman. You can find them used for cheap. $20 all day long.
Author:  RSPvideo [ Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Yeah, I figured it would be best to replace it but I had a guy at the boat shop here tell me it would be fine to patch it some how.
Where do you find these $20 rails???
Author:  RSPvideo [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
update: got a replacement for $25! I am hopefully installing the rail along with a new trampoline this weekend. I was looking at the frame trying to figure out how to take it apart. Once I have the old trampoline off, can I just use a rubber mallet to seperate the side rails from the front and rear rails?

now i have 1 silver rail and 1 black rail. somebody i'll have to swap out that other rail, the difference in color is going to drive me nuts!
Author:  MBounds [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
RSPvideo wrote:
update: got a replacement for $25! I am hopefully installing the rail along with a new trampoline this weekend. I was looking at the frame trying to figure out how to take it apart. Once I have the old trampoline off, can I just use a rubber mallet to seperate the side rails from the front and rear rails?

now i have 1 silver rail and 1 black rail. somebody i'll have to swap out that other rail, the difference in color is going to drive me nuts!


Undo the trampoline lacing. Remove the tramp side on the side with the broken rail. Remove the bolt in the rear corner casting on that same side. On an older boat, the corner casting should come right up with a few whacks of a rubber mallet. You may need to loosen the other rear corner or front corners, too if it puts up too much of a fight.

Once the rear casting is up off the hull, you should be able to easily remove the siderail by pulling the corner aft and wiggling it out.

Reverse the process with the new rail and your're done. It's about a 2 beverage job.

Cover the rails with carpet or neoprene to provide footing for trapezing. You'll hardly notice the different colors.
Author:  RSPvideo [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
excellent, thank you! i should have mentioned that the frame and hulls are seperated for painting. I'm hoping this will be a breeze.
Author:  Jman6631 [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Definitely recommend doing the neoprene. The price difference is way less than the performance and longevity difference; $54 vice $36, or half again as much and you get a lot more performance and life out of the neoprene, and chances are you'll end up going with the neoprene anyway.

All I ever hear and read is how quickly the carpet wears out and how much water the carpet holds and how much folks wish they just had gone with the neoprene to begin with and saved themselves the hassle of doing it twice. This one is also about a two beer job :lol: .

If you can't tell I like doing things right the first time even if it costs me a little more up front.
Author:  RSPvideo [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Yeah, I'm a fan of doing things right too. Unfortunately I'm so new at this that I don't yet know what the right way is. I'll look in the catalog, but is the neoprene something that hobie makes or is it after market? If after market, where can I order it?

Speaking of after market, what are your thoughts on the standing rigging sets on eBay?
Author:  Jman6631 [ Wed Jun 16, 2010 7:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Definitely, you like to do things right the first time too, sorry if that sounded a little pointed, it's not what I intended.... :oops:

I bought the neoprene kit you see in the catalog from the local hobie shop. With most hobie branded or sourced stuff you know it will be quality and it will all fit and work together correctly with rare exception, and this kit is no different even though it is just rubber matting, 3M contact cement and a $1 brush. I could justify the cost of the other kits even further where the neoprene is cut out in strategic places to fit around posts and grommets, etc.

I'm definitely a fan of cooking my own recipes and finding my own solutions. In this case I just bought the kit and did it. Probably could have saved some moolah sourcing elsewhere but I'm finally getting it through my thick skull that at this point in my life (43 with 8 y.o. twin girls) I don't have to re-invent the wheel EVERY time :roll: :lol: ....So, I don't know where else to send you, I can only tell you what I did.

One nice thing I can tell you about the kit is that the leftovers are just long enough to install on the outboard aft topsides for trap footing when down winding when it really gets blowing. Flip to page 9 of the current catalog and note the "Race strips" kit description item number 16707, and also check out the "Non-skid" item number 16713 also on p. 9, both of which the leftovers make unnecessary - bonus! The pic on p. 26, which looks like a 17 Sport to me but what do I know, shows similar strips installed aft of the tramp all nicely contoured, but serve the exact same purpose.

I bought the aftermarket standing (and running) rigging on eBay and so far so good. In the future I'll go to the local shop (b/c I believe in spending locally), or Surf City, or Murray's. Each of which I know offer competitive pricing ad will stand behind their sales and all offer great support. One thing to note, on the running rigging I got from eBay, the main halyard was ~6" too short, which was just enough to make it unusable. I told the seller and while they were certain they cut them accurately they asked me to re-measure (I did and sent photos) and once convinced they sent a new one.

I'm in the same boat you are. I read the catalogs, Hobie's and Murray's, like textbooks and read this forum until my eyes bleed, but it's not like I have deep knowledge b/c I don't have a lot of experience yet, just common sense and a willingness to take some chances and learn. In the end, the bulk of my learning has been from this forum.
Author:  Skipshot [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
RSPvideo wrote:
Speaking of after market, what are your thoughts on the standing rigging sets on eBay?
This question can be answered after giving us more information.

Are the sails original?

How old is the current standing rigging? Hobie changed the length of the shrouds and forestay to increase mast rake which reduces the likelihood of pitchpoling and improves the ability of the boat to point upwind.
Author:  RSPvideo [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
Yes, the sails are originals and they are in good enough condition for me. I'm hopefully going to have somebody that knows what they are doing take a look at the standing rigging. The local boat shop (www.smallboatvt.com) can do the rigging for basically the same price as the riggings on ebay. I would much rather give the business to the local guys.
Author:  Skipshot [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: snapped side rail and other questions.
In that case, go ahead and get the shrouds and forestay made to the lengths you now have, it's the easiest solution. Standing rigging also includes anchor pins, the number one culprit for falling masts.
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