Hobie Forums
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/

Old H16 - Need your help
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=36622		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Iwuzowned [ Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Old H16 - Need your help
I have an older H16.

When I bought this boat, I knew it was rough, but I needed a project, so I bought it. I paid $150 for the boat and trailer........

First thing I noticed is that when I put it in the water, it immediately sank.

Found out that the hull as it sits on a trailer on those four little rubber rollers, had worn through in all four points. The seller did not let me know that........

I took random strand strips of fiberglass and glasseed the entire length on both hulls. Then I used woven strips slightly wider and went down the entire length of both hulls. Turned out pretty good, but you can see my seams along the hull. Frankly this boat is old and pretty beaten up, so I don't care much.

It does not have the comptip modification that probably should have been done.

Anyway, I have been sailing this boat for three years now, and I am having a blast with it!

I had my son follow me on our Seadoo in a very stiff wind, and he told me that at the fastest, I was going 26 mph..........


Here is the problem that I am having with the boat. IT IS EXTREMELY HARD TO HOLD THE BOAT STRAIGHT. There is alot of force required to keep the boat steering straight. It wants to turn into the wind. After about an hour of sailing, my hands are tired of trying to keep the boat going straight. I bet there has to be 20+ pounds of pressure. If I put more than me in the boat, the problem gets even worse. The more wind, the more pressure........

School me guys, my hands will appreciate it!!

What can I do to relieve the steering pressure?
Author:  Jman6631 [ Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
26 mph, wow, good for you!

Sounds like it's the classic weather helm issue. You correct that by raking the rudders UNDER the boat. There are many posts here that will help you on the details. I happen to have the written up how-to that I can email you.

I had the same problem and was getting worn out too and doing this mod solved it. Now I have just a little bit of weather helm, enough not to wear me out but enough so that when I let go of the tiller she points into the wind and stops. That's the safety margin you need to maintain. Too much raking and you loose weather helm, if you let go of the tiller she picks up speed and heads downwind - dangerous. If you follow the instructions to the letter you'll be fine.

Verify if you have the older non-adjustable rudder housings or the newer adjustable ones.
Author:  annacat [ Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
I only wish I was having that problem.
Author:  jsloan999 [ Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
I had the same issue when I first sailed my H16 due to extreme toe in of my rudders.

Turned out that I had the rudders reversed. Rookie mistake. Five minute fix.
Author:  Iwuzowned [ Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
There is no way to adjust them. Non adjustable
Author:  Jman6631 [ Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
They are, it's just not as easy. On the old school non-adjustable rudders housings you achieve rudder rake by re-drilling the two mounting holes. It's a fairly easy mod that has been successful for years. Mine came out perfect.

If you mean the toe-in, removing the assembly and basically "flipping" it over to reverses the toe-out to a toe-in while facing forward. That's a five minute fix.
Author:  Iwuzowned [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
Ok, after doing some reading on here, I looked at my rudders when at speed. They are both coming up in the water.

If I take the tiller, lift it up and jam the rudders forward, and not lean on the tiller at all, the rudders stay down. If I put pressure on the tiller at all, the rudders will lift backwards and towards the surface making it very difficult to keep holding on the tiller.

Looks like I need to get a new set of those locking cams. It appears that that little bar that slides under those cams, it not actually sliding under on either side.

Maybe worn out? Probably so.........
Author:  srm [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
Your cams could be worn out or stuck in the "down" position, the holes in your rudders could be drilled improperly, the cam pressure screw (under-side of lower rudder casting) could be too loose, or you might just not be locking the rudders down properly. There should be no need to "jam" the rudder forward. You rock the rudders back, sliding the upper casting along the lower casting until it clicks and locks into position.

Whatever the root cause is, the underlying problem is that your rudders are not staying down. If they don't stay down, you will experience extreme weather helm as you have found. The first thing I would do before going out and dropping cash on parts that you may not need, is to do some reasearch to get a good understanding of how the system is supposed to work. The fix could be as simple as applying some lube to the cam/plunger and adjusting the tension screw.

Search earlier posts, check out the FAQ, and review recent issues of the Hotline. These are all good sources of information to get your rudders working correctly. Then experiment with the system while the boat is no the trailer so you're comfortable with operating the rudders before getting on the water.

It's a pretty simple system, but if it isn't working right, the boat is no fun to sail.



sm
Author:  fpichel [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
my bet is that your cams are stuck down. I had this exact problem when I first started out.
I tried prying them up with a screw driver but no dice.
I bought new ones - everything was so much better after that.

Fix the cam problem first, then you can look into toe-in and mast rake, etc. if you're still having too strong a weather helm.
Author:  Jman6631 [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
The above posters are probably right. You can rebuild your rudder housing. When I first got my boat and had no idea how they worked I found a step-by-step video (by Jeremy at Surf City Catamarans??).

If I ever find the link again I'll let you know.
Author:  wildlatin [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
I think I know how the cam system is supposed to work- but it only works right when I release the locked rudders by pushing on them. This would be great if/when I am sailing onto a beautiful beach in Maui or somewhere :roll: ...

Isn't there supposed to be some way to raise the rudders, while keeping the cams in the proper position, so that they can be re-locked and lowered from the tramp just using the tiller crossbar? If so I haven't gotten it to work as the cam always gets out of synch with the bars releasing while the cam is still locked, etc.

Anybody have a good video showing how the H16/14 rudder system is supposed to work?
Author:  srm [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 6:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
Yes, you should be able to raise the rudders manually from the tramp by lifting the tiller arm and pulling it forward. When you do this, the cam should flip to the "up" position.

If the cam is not flipping, then either the hook part of the cam is worn out (they can get soft and flexible over time), the cam tension screw is too tight, the cam is not properly lubricated, the holes in the rudder are mislocated meaning the pin in the upper casting is not properly engaging the hook part of the cam, or the rudder rake is mis-adjusted (on the new system).

All the info you need is in the FAQ.

sm
Author:  MBounds [ Wed Jul 20, 2011 6:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
wildlatin wrote:
I think I know how the cam system is supposed to work- but it only works right when I release the locked rudders by pushing on them. This would be great if/when I am sailing onto a beautiful beach in Maui or somewhere :roll: ...

Isn't there supposed to be some way to raise the rudders, while keeping the cams in the proper position, so that they can be re-locked and lowered from the tramp just using the tiller crossbar? If so I haven't gotten it to work as the cam always gets out of synch with the bars releasing while the cam is still locked, etc.

Your problem is that the pin (or plate, if it's newer than 1983) in the upper casting is not seating firmly in the "crook" of the cam when the rudder is locked down. When you lock down the rudder, can you move the tip of the rudder fore and aft? That's the pin sliding back and forth on the cam. It will kick up properly when you pull back on the tip (seating the pin in the crook and rotating the cam). If you just lift on the tiller, the pin is too far out on the cam; it flexes the hook on the cam, releases and the cam stays in the locked-down position.

The solution is to re-drill the rudders (pre-1983) or adjust the lock-down plate (post-1983).

wildlatin wrote:
Anybody have a good video showing how the H16/14 rudder system is supposed to work?
It wouldn't show very much, since the mechanism is hidden by the castings. This might help, though:
Image
Note that if you have pre-1983, the plate and adjusting screw is replaced by a single pin.
Author:  Little Wing [ Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
Do they still make the after market, adjuster plate, for the pre 83 sixteens?
Author:  MBounds [ Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Old H16 - Need your help
It's not in the latest catalog, but I'll bet there's a dealer out there who still has one.

I've also seen someone remove the lockdown pin, carve a fore and aft slot in the casting where the pin was and use a bolt/nut/lockwashers to replace the pin.
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/