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| technique question http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=55855 |
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| Author: | jwallis [ Mon Aug 31, 2015 11:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | technique question |
I've been sailing a hobie 16 for years but have figured out a lot of things the hard way, and I have a question that after thinking about for months I still do not have a great solution for. My girl and I were sailing on the lake in a very pleasant ~10mph breeze all day. A storm rolls in slowly (no lightning or anything) and we head home, which is a dead run to the beach in a U shaped cove. The wind suddenly kicks up to 25-30mph and we are hauling ass. If it were a long beach I would just make a very wide turn, pull the jib over and come into the wind, but our approach to the beach is very narrow, because the cove is U shaped AND because there are children playing on either side of where we intend to beach it. So we're going VERY fast and I have no room to make a wide turn. I could dump some wind by bringing both sails in, but the wind is finicky and I don't want to risk an accidental jibe. If we hit the beach at this speed, with a 25mph wind behind us I have little doubt that we will stick in the mud and pitchpole on solid ground. So I take the only option I see which is to get us both on the side opposite the main, lean out and crank it hard to try to stop us quickly (which works great if you're going 10mph). Of course we flip spectacularly in about 4ft water and probably make ourselves look very dangerous to everyone around us. Then we sit there for 15 minutes just trying to keep the sails from tearing themselves apart in the high wind. The things we could have done I guess would be -girlfriend jumps out prior to inevitable capsize to avoid getting hurt (considered, she didn't want to) -drag something to reduce speed -make wide turn into the wind far out from shore, try to back it in from far away (I'm not very good at backing up but others seem to be very good) -possibly beach somewhere else and walk it a long way to our spot -? other ideas ? Thanks! |
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| Author: | srm [ Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
Back it in. About 20-30 yards upwind of your destination, dump sheets and make a very sharp and committed turn up into the wind. Obviously you want both crew to be seated on the windward rail prior to making this turn. Once you reach head to wind, the crew should move forward on the tramp and the skipper should reach back and pull the rudders up all the way. The boat will blow backwards towards the beach and the crew can jump off and hold the bow when the water is shallow enough to stand. sm |
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| Author: | SabresfortheCup [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
I agree with srm. I hate beaching (it ruins your hulls), and I usually either anchor my boat, dock it or trailer it. Docking on a cement ramp is tricky, as it's pretty much always a downwind sail into the dock and you can't stop downwind. I slow my boat as much as possible coming in by sailing deep downwind and letting my sails all the way out. When I'm within a few boat lengths of the dock, I jam the rudders hard over and bring the main in tight, pointing the boat right into the wind. Then I release the main and push the boom out to one side, letting the wind blow me backwards, while steering in with the rudders. I'll have my crew grab onto the dock or jump in and hold the boat in place while I drop the mainsail (which only works pointed into the wind), and then spin the boat around to get it onto the trailer. The safest way to come in to a beach downwind with a lot of wind is to back it in. It's a little tricky, but well worth practicing. It allows you another option to maneuver your boat when you get in a tricky spot, like this one. If the approach is too narrow and/or rocky to back in from a distance, then I'd say try to beach it somewhere else nearby if you can and sail it back over another day when the wind isn't as strong. |
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| Author: | greensnopro [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 2:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
will lifting the rudders work for light wind and getting stuck in the irons to close to the dunes where there is almost no shallow water and it's full of boats with no place to beach? that happened to me and one of the guys came in and help me spin around  but it was embarrassing,..... sounds like thats what i needed to learn to do
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| Author: | rattle 'n hum [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 3:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
Try bailing a little sooner! Otherwise, back it in per srm's instructions. I'd recommend laying the hiking stick on one of the tillers so that it can't lift and make the rudders drop accidently. If you center the traveler and sheet the main a little, it will help ensure the bow stays pointed into the wind. You can also go out and sit on the bows to help make sure it backs straight back, but I can't say I've done that in really hairy stuff. Good thread. |
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| Author: | greensnopro [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 3:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
I did bail early, unfortunately I got stuck in the irons like 4 times trying to tack, I just couldn't get around the corner, SMH. I've since learned I was also popping the jib to soon. It was my second time solo to so I wasn't sure how the heck to handle it. Told the guy thanks a million and I was still trying to learn, he shouted anytime and keep working at it. |
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| Author: | srm [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
If you're trying to get out of irons, lifting the rudders is not the answer. You need to learn how to do a "K" turn by reversing the rudders and pushing the mainsail as far away from you as possible. This will cause the boat to sail backwards and turn off of the wind. Once the boat is out of irons, you pull the rudders in and pull the sails in to get going forward. Best to practice in an open area away from other boats. Once you master this technique, you can pretty much make your boat do whatever you want. Getting caught in irons becomes a non-issue. sm |
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| Author: | waheed [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
Backing in is only going to work if there are not real waves. If its windy and there sizable waves backing in is going to be a bad time. |
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| Author: | mdgann [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 10:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
This is how you beach in high winds. You gotta watch the whole 13 minutes for the technique at the end. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09ql0oNr7BI I usually have a choice of rocks or concrete ramp. I choose the ramp every time. Center the sheet and traveler and full lock to lock rudder a few times to take the edge off the speed just before it shallows. I have been beaching my current boat for 7 years now and have not "ruined" my hulls. This is a "beach cat" after all. Been sailing for 45 years and have only done one bottom job on a beach cat. Admittedly all 45 years have not been in hobie 16s. That's just where I started when I was 12. My cousins were rich California kids and took me sailing for the first time. Kind of reminds me of folks who buy a jeep rubicon and never go off road. Sail these things like you mean it. "Eddy would go" if you know what I mean. |
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| Author: | greensnopro [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 2:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
thanks sm, I will study and practice the "K" turn. |
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| Author: | rattle 'n hum [ Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
greensnopro: Sorry if my post was confusing, it was intended for the OP who was asking about going into the beach hot and downwind. I don't quite understand your scenario....are you trying to get into the beach in light air upwind, get way from it downwind, other? Upwind into the beach in light air, it may be easier just to paddle. Backing downwind away from the beach as described above will work in light air. You can even hand-hold the jib backwinded to increase your speed. Hope this helps! |
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| Author: | jwallis [ Tue Sep 08, 2015 11:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
Thanks to all who replied. srm and Sabres addressed my question directly and yes, cranking the tiller is basically what I always do, and in lower wind works fine, in fact I always really enjoy sailing at the shore hot and having my crew say "we're going way too fast!" not knowing how fantastic a small cat handles. Unfortunately we were going WAY too fast and I did want to sheet in the main but the wind was variable enough that I was afraid if I didn't keep the main out that we might have a really hard accidental jibe. I think the idea of killing some speed by going cutting back and forth just 15deg each way is a good idea as someone suggested. Then maybe I could have tried heading up and backing it in. |
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| Author: | Hammond [ Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: technique question |
Find a different place to sail and land. No technique is safe in any wind landing on a tight beach down wind where children are playing in the water. Even a slow moving boat can really harm a distracted kid. |
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