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Using fiberglass cloth with epoxy
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=6399		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  pappastratos [ Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Using fiberglass cloth with epoxy
Can I use epoxy with fiberglass mat instead of resin ? I have extensive fiberglass repair with resin, but you have no control of drying times when it is hot out side. It costs less than epoxy, more dangerous to breathe. I need the longer dry time to repair a delam & fiberglass mat for a void area. Plus the resin dissolves the foam core.
Author:  mmiller [ Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Resin?
Resin disolves the foam core? No, I don't think so. At least the resins we build the boats with have no effect.

I don't quite understand the rest of the question. Epoxy IS resin, just a different type from polyesther. You can use epoxy with glass fiber. No problem.
Author:  abbman [ Wed Mar 21, 2007 6:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
I know that sometimes with some foams petroleum based resins can damage the foam. For instance, I've been thinking about fibergalssing over an all foam lockley sea devil, or now the snark sea skimmer, because the abs plastic has deteriorated. I just want to fix her up for kicks. Their company strongly discorages any petroleum based products, specifically polyester resin directly on the foam as it can cause it to deteriorate. I believe that I would have to use a fiberglass mat that is compatible with epoxy, I don't believe that all of them are? I don't have much experience with this or anything but I've done a little bit of research for this project and that is what I've found. I think most of it has to do with the particular foam used. So, as Mr. Miller suggested I believe the polyester resin would not deteriorate the foam used in the hobies, I believe that is what the boat was made of in the first place. But if you do use epoxy I would be sure to check that the mat you purchase is compatible with epoxy.
Author:  pappastratos [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:43 am ]
Post subject: 
I have read that the true fiberglass resin will disolve the foam core. That is why people use epoxy for delam repair. I want to know if I can use epoxy with fiberglass cloth for hull & delam repair.
Author:  mmiller [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 8:49 am ]
Post subject:  Which resin?
pappastratos wrote:
I have read that the true fiberglass resin will disolve the foam core. That is why people use epoxy for delam repair. I want to know if I can use epoxy with fiberglass cloth for hull & delam repair.


A) The type of foam used in the Hobie foam sandwich will not dissolve with Polyester or Epoxy resins. This is not Styrofoam (like the flotation chunk of foam in the hull)... which will dissolve.

B) You can use either type of resin to make a repair. But use woven cloth if using epoxy resins. There is a binder material in mat glass that only dissolves with polyester resins.
Author:  JACK FLASH [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 11:02 am ]
Post subject: 
Matt has already covered the proper details. They do make a mat that is for use in epoxy resins. A good source for the stuff is www.fibreglast.com
I also by my mixing cups, additives, resins, and popcycle sticks from them for far less then you can buy them at the marine store. They also sell exotics like carbon fiber, kevlar etc. And no, I don't work for them. Just one thing I wanted to point out about foam cores. If polyester resin disolves foam cores, how would they have ever built the boat in the first place? Would not have the foam core disolved during construction? As to the original starter of post I believe you said that you are repairng a Snark sailboat. Snark sailboats use styrofoam which will disolve chemically in polyester resin. They used styrofoam to make a low cost boat. I loved my snark, think I bought it new from Sears for under 500.00 back in the 80's.
Author:  abbman [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 11:25 am ]
Post subject: 
Hey Jack Flash,
I wasn't the original poster but am the one that posted about the Snark. My dad bought it back in the day, before I was a glint in his eye and I think he also paid about 500 for it. It sat in the garage for years and years, I think I was about 13 before I even knew it was there :( . One day, here recently, I took it out and told myself that I was gonna fix her back up for kicks and maybe to give myself a little more experience with boat repair. The ABS plastic that they used to cover the styrofoam core had deteriorated really badly and the foam had become a little water logged so I have removed all of the plastic and left it under a shelter to dry out a little bit. The company says that they can be fiberglassed and that is what I plan on doing. It's a really small boat like 3'1/2" by 12' but I like the sailboard design of it. I figure I can put it right on top of my hobie when I go sailing and set her up for myself or others to play on. Plus I think it would be a great little boat for some of the younger members of my family to play on. Or maybe for my girlfriend to sunbathe on. I remember when I first took her out on the hobie and she said, "what, your not gonna let me lay out on this thing?" as I handed her the jib sheets. I think she understood why once we got going to speed and heeling over a bit.

I'm definately a novice with all of this boat repair stuff and I think that this will be a fun way to get started and become a little more familiar with fiberglass. Only problem I see is that I don't have the sails or the dimensions. I found a company that makes them out of dacron, which I think is a bit overkill for cloth for this boat, but their prices are like 500 dollars for the main and jib :shock: . So I may try making my own out of nylon or something. What kind of Snark did you have? You don't still have the sails do you :lol: ?
Author:  JACK FLASH [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 11:47 am ]
Post subject: 
No my nephew now has that boat. Still around. The plastic is a weak area if kept out doors. DISCLAIMER: The plastic these boats are made out of are in no way a comparrison to the Hobie Kayaks and Rotomolded boats. The boats are still produced and can be mail ordered, I think for about 600 dollars now. You can still buy parts and sails and hulls and the like.
Author:  abbman [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 2:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Right on. I'm glad to hear that it's still being used. Your absolutely right about the disclaimer. I can just see the heads popping up as they read this post. The hobie plastics and the snark plastics aren't even in the same ball park. When I took the plastic off of the snark it came off like paper, not to mention that it was a paper thin. No where near the quality of a hobie product, or at least I think so anyway. But the snark's look like fun little boats, I wish better care had been taken of this one but at least it will give me something to do. They're a little more expensive now as I found out during my research. The sea skimmer goes for about 1100 if orderd from castlecraft. Times they are a changin'.
Author:  pappastratos [ Thu Mar 22, 2007 2:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Plus the fiberglass resin odors are pretty rough, I can smell it for days. I have a area that the foam deteriorated & want to push some fiberglass cloth/epoxy into this area.
Author:  JACK FLASH [ Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:29 am ]
Post subject: 
Yeah the plastics are different. I think the Hobie is made of Polypropaline, the Snarks are made out of the same crud they used to make icechest out of. In fact, I think an icechest is where the concept for that boat came from.
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