Hobie Forums :: View topic - AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?

I don't know about flat out, but I do know that I've had to reduce my cadence considerably to get my trolling speed down to optimum when I moved to the ai2

I think you have misunderstood. I believe the AI2 miragedrive fins are structurally similar to those on the AI1, but the hull is bigger, and more importantly, the new miragedrive has additional bearings, which reportedly make performance about ten percent more efficient than the older drive

I believe my 2011 AI mirage drive had the same size fins as my new AI 2 drive.

I don't know about flat out, but I do know that I've had to reduce my cadence considerably to get my trolling speed down to optimum when I moved to the ai2
I'm like princess and the pea when it comes to pedaling, all the miles on the bike are now infiltrating my fishing!

He says it is a 2015, but I notice that it has handles on the side and recall that 2015 AI owners complain about the lack of handles. Also it has the twist-and-stow rudder while the pix of AI-2's I have seen have the flip-up rudder. OTOH, it has the removable beach chair/seat.... So I guess the jury is out on whether I was trying a hull that is identical to an AI-2.

Next task is to find out if the AI-2 reduces that leg room with iako placement - which they did manage to do on the 2009 TI that I tried on for size a week ago.

I believe my complaints about the T-n-S rudder on the AI helped push Hobie over the edge (to make the plunge, so to say) and change to a real rudder on the TI/AI. The T-n-S rudder is probably just fine on the Revolution 16; although at those speeds it could be a problem.

The Revo 16 is the same hull as the Adventure and the AIv1.
It is not the same as the AIv2 hull which was redesigned with a fuller bow and other changes which add considerably to its hull weight. Reading posts of those who swapped from AIv1 to AIv2 it is not as versatile in kayak mode, being wider and heavier and with a higher seating position. It is a much better sailing boat.

Author:	PeteCress [ Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:43 pm ]
Post subject:	AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
Does anybody have actual experierience vis-a-vis how fast they can go flat-out in an AI-1 vs AI-2 using just the Mirage Drive? Few days ago, I ran into a guy with what he said was a 2015 Revolution 16 (which I assume is the exact same hull shape as a 2015 AI) and he consented to see how fast he could pedal while I followed in my surf ski. Going into a stiff breeze he was holding 6.0-6.5 mph - and I was glad when he stopped because I could not have kept it up much longer. Was surprised at the speed - especially in the larger/beamier 2015 shape. OTOH, my GPS is a wrist unit (small numbers) and seems possible that I was mis-reading it. OTOOH this guy was at least 30 years younger than I am and appeared both strong and in pretty good shape. So: Does anybody elses' experience support those numbers? . Could an AI-1 hull be significantly faster/easier to pedal than an AI-2 hull?

Author:	mmiller [ Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
The original Adventure Island (main hull) was called the Adventure. Re-named Revolution 16 when we came out with the 2015 Adventure Island. Two very different hulls. The Revo 16 is likely the faster of the two... pedaled hull only, but I don't have facts on that for any reason. Just a guess due to the newer hull being wider.

Author:	skymax [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:31 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
IMO the Revo 15/16 should be a tad faster given the same pilot weight, Fins and Rudder by virtue of it's lighter weight, but not significantly. The new AI2 does display 4" more hull height to the breeze so if in wind as a Kayak only that would be another affect possible.

Author:	coachstevo [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 4:33 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
I don't know about flat out, but I do know that I've had to reduce my cadence considerably to get my trolling speed down to optimum when I moved to the ai2 I'm like princess and the pea when it comes to pedaling, all the miles on the bike are now infiltrating my fishing!

Author:	PeteCress [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
coachstevo wrote: I don't know about flat out, but I do know that I've had to reduce my cadence considerably to get my trolling speed down to optimum when I moved to the ai2 If the AI-1 had stock flippers, maybe the longer flippers on the AI-2 could be part of it.... Higher "gear" maybe... ?

Hobie Forums http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/

AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort? http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=55473	Page 1 of 2

Author:	tonystott [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
I think you have misunderstood. I believe the AI2 miragedrive fins are structurally similar to those on the AI1, but the hull is bigger, and more importantly, the new miragedrive has additional bearings, which reportedly make performance about ten percent more efficient than the older drive

Author:	PeteCress [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:09 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
tonystott wrote: I think you have misunderstood. I believe the AI2 miragedrive fins are structurally similar to those on the AI1, but the hull is bigger, and more importantly, the new miragedrive has additional bearings, which reportedly make performance about ten percent more efficient than the older drive AFIK, the AI-2 fins are larger than the stock AI-1 fins and have blue markings on them - as opposed to the AI-1's all-black fins. Also AFIK: for an AI-1, one can purchase "Turbo" fins to get the larger size. Somebody correct me if I am wrong.

Author:	stringy [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
It depends what model AI you have. Early models came with the standard fin but at some stage Turbo fins became standard issue with Islands. I can't remember exactly when ...maybe 2008 with the introduction of the lever locks or 2010 when the TI was released?

Author:	Chekika [ Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
I believe my 2011 AI mirage drive had the same size fins as my new AI 2 drive. Keith

Author:	PeteCress [ Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:38 am ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
Chekika wrote: I believe my 2011 AI mirage drive had the same size fins as my new AI 2 drive. Thanks - I had assumed it was a 2014-2015 thing.

Author:	PeteCress [ Tue Aug 11, 2015 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
coachstevo wrote: I don't know about flat out, but I do know that I've had to reduce my cadence considerably to get my trolling speed down to optimum when I moved to the ai2 I'm like princess and the pea when it comes to pedaling, all the miles on the bike are now infiltrating my fishing! Today I had another chance to paddle my surfski with the same guy mentioned in the OP. I spotted him about 3/4 miles away. He stuck out like a sore thumb because he was moving so much faster than everybody else. Practically killed myself catching up with him. I think he makes about 6.2-6.5 steady-state, just pedaling along - which is about what I make on my surfski - but cannot hold for much more than two miles at a time. Following him to shore where he let me try it on for size, I was holding 7.2-7.5 milking his wake. Turns out that his 16' Revolution with the pedals max forward just fits my long legs. He says it is a 2015, but I notice that it has handles on the side and recall that 2015 AI owners complain about the lack of handles. Also it has the twist-and-stow rudder while the pix of AI-2's I have seen have the flip-up rudder. OTOH, it has the removable beach chair/seat.... So I guess the jury is out on whether I was trying a hull that is identical to an AI-2. Next task is to find out if the AI-2 reduces that leg room with iako placement - which they did manage to do on the 2009 TI that I tried on for size a week ago. Edit 2015 08-21 16:24: Turns out that AI-2 has sufficient leg room for my 44" hip-to-floor legs, long shins, and size 15 feet - so I pulled the trigger on a purchase with delivery claimed for 8/25. The tension mounts.....

Author:	Chekika [ Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
You can look at the Hobie site for the 2015 Mirage Revolution 16--it has the T-n-S rudder and Vantage seat. I believe my complaints about the T-n-S rudder on the AI helped push Hobie over the edge (to make the plunge, so to say) and change to a real rudder on the TI/AI. The T-n-S rudder is probably just fine on the Revolution 16; although at those speeds it could be a problem. Keith

Author:	stringy [ Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
PeteCress wrote: He says it is a 2015, but I notice that it has handles on the side and recall that 2015 AI owners complain about the lack of handles. Also it has the twist-and-stow rudder while the pix of AI-2's I have seen have the flip-up rudder. OTOH, it has the removable beach chair/seat.... So I guess the jury is out on whether I was trying a hull that is identical to an AI-2. Next task is to find out if the AI-2 reduces that leg room with iako placement - which they did manage to do on the 2009 TI that I tried on for size a week ago. Pete, The Revo 16 is the same hull as the Adventure and the AIv1. It is not the same as the AIv2 hull which was redesigned with a fuller bow and other changes which add considerably to its hull weight. Reading posts of those who swapped from AIv1 to AIv2 it is not as versatile in kayak mode, being wider and heavier and with a higher seating position. It is a much better sailing boat.

Author:	PeteCress [ Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
Chekika wrote: I believe my complaints about the T-n-S rudder on the AI helped push Hobie over the edge (to make the plunge, so to say) and change to a real rudder on the TI/AI. The T-n-S rudder is probably just fine on the Revolution 16; although at those speeds it could be a problem. Looks to me like the T-n-S rudder adds a few more points of failure. I noted that the guy with the Revo that I tried was having trouble with his.... so I, too, like the idea of a "real" rudder.

Page 1 of 2	All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/

Author:	PeteCress [ Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:04 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: AI-1 vs AI-2: Mirage Drive Speed/Effort?
stringy wrote: The Revo 16 is the same hull as the Adventure and the AIv1. It is not the same as the AIv2 hull which was redesigned with a fuller bow and other changes which add considerably to its hull weight. Reading posts of those who swapped from AIv1 to AIv2 it is not as versatile in kayak mode, being wider and heavier and with a higher seating position. It is a much better sailing boat. Thanks for saving me from myself on that one. I was all ready to go out and buy an AI-2 once I confirmed that it had my leg length covered. That is not to say that I'm not still drawn to the AI-2... but I need to "Feel" it before I go jumping in. Thought I had that covered with the Revo... but now I know... There is a guy with a genuine AI-2 that comes to the lake where I paddle... so now I have to manage to be there at the same time he is and beg a ride....