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New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=55874		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  PaulJ [ Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Just got my TI on Friday. I feel like I already have earned some experience :D


My two questions so far:

1) For those who use the scupper cart with the cradle, whats your secret to putting it on at the end of the day? We did a lot of struggling to finally get it in there and it wasn't the most graceful thing. I was hoping to launch and retrieve this boat all by myself but at this point I'm not sure I could handle it alone until I can get the technique of that. The boat is simply too heavy to lift and roll with the cart in the 'easy rear holes, but very very difficult to get the cart plugged into the front holes. I tried to put the cart under the boat while in the water and the beach wheels were so buoyant, it was nearly impossible to get it lined up. I am wondering if I made the correct cart choice...

2) What is the reasonable conditions or indicators that make you furl your sail? And how much mast flex is OK? We really got ripping a couple of times in what I would guess were 15-20 MPH puffs, and the mast really bent over, perhaps to 25-30 degrees. I was worried and furled it a turn, but then the wind died so we put it back out. Rinse and repeat. What indications do you use to tell you that you need to furl sail on this boat?





So the rest of the long story is below.........................................:

Friday evening my wife and I took the boat out and sailed it for the first time - light winds, but we did notice one of the akas kept coming loose from the crossbar. sure enough, in my garage I can pull it loose with a few up & down tugs that simulate the forces of tacking left & right. My dealer promptly responded monday morning to my email so I feel confident that Hobie is on it based on other info I've read here. I tied some paracord keeper lines on all 4 corners that night as we did actually have the ama fold in on us in (luckily) light winds.

Saturday was my friends birthday, and my wife was working, so I took him out on the new boat. We had a total blast, sailed over 15 miles in bay and coastal waters. A few hours into it I think we were both feeling fairly confident and I made the mistake of coming around a tack without first having him sit back in the seat from the tramp. Well, with 200 Lbs of dude on the downwind tramp and some pretty decent winds, we promptly flipped the boat :shock: . Luckily I have been doing some reading on these forums for some time and I had an idea of what to do about it, we almost had it righted once by ourselves, except my friend was pulling on a bungee and it snapped loose, sending the boat turtle again. We started the process again and at this time, the local harbor patrol had already pulled up (maybe 2 minutes after the flip? very quick!) and one of their guys jumped in and helped us get enough weight on the folded-in side to right it quickly. Lesson learned, and I'm glad I was not either alone or with my wife the first time that happened. We gave the harbor patrol a shout on the VHF afterwards to offer another thanks, I think they were surprised we had a radio at all.


Anyways, it's great to be here and actually have the boat in my garage rather than watch all of you guys have fun on the internet :-)
Author:  Buckaroo [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Paul I recently started using the HD cart with TuffTires and it isn't too difficult to get it in the scupper holes if you are in the water next to the boat and the akas are extended. I hold the cart with one hand on the cradle and my second hand on one of the pipes that goes in the scupper holes and use the fingers of that hand to locate the scupper groove on the bottom of the boat. Once the near pin is in it's scupper hole it's pretty easy to find the other one. If you are not pulling across soft sand it would probably make your life a lot easier to switch tires. I bought the cart specifically to make solo launching/retrieval easier. I think you have to be able to get into the water low and next to the boat to insert the cart easily, wouldn't be much fun in cold water.

Chris
Author:  RandomJoe [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
PaulJ wrote:
2) What is the reasonable conditions or indicators that make you furl your sail? And how much mast flex is OK? We really got ripping a couple of times in what I would guess were 15-20 MPH puffs, and the mast really bent over, perhaps to 25-30 degrees. I was worried and furled it a turn, but then the wind died so we put it back out. Rinse and repeat. What indications do you use to tell you that you need to furl sail on this boat?


At some point the sail will overpower the rudder and you start turning into the wind no matter what you do with the rudder. When that happens I do one of two things.

1) If it's just a brief gust and I know the wind is going to drop a bit quickly, I just ease off the sheet to depower the sail. Once the wind drops, sheet in again and continue on.

2) If the wind is staying too high, or I'm tired of messing with the sheet all the time, I'll furl in some. I generally don't furl just a turn or two, as the sail gets a really screwy shape due to the partially wrapped first batten and sometimes flutters noisily at the top. If I have to furl I usually go until the first batten is completely wrapped.

I've stopped worrying about how far the mast is bent over, it's apparently designed to do that!
Author:  recycle [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Wow, I'm surprised you could flip a TI without an aka collapsing. I guess if someone is sitting on the tramp though anything is possible.

I will admit that a couple of times when I was launching my AI, I actually forgot to remove the wheels. I had to remove them once in the water which actually isn't too difficult. The experience makes me wonder if putting your wheels on when you are off-shore before you land might be the easiest thing to do. With the ama's on the boat (and no one on the tramp :wink:) you could sit on the side and slide them in I would think... ? Haven't tried it though.
Author:  PassWind [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 8:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
guys used to fill the balloon tires partially with water to make them less buoyant and easier to get under the boat
Author:  fusioneng [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
When we use our trailer we just leave the scupper cart at home. Sometimes though we have to car top our TI (mostly in Key West). My TI is just too dang heavy for me to try and roll on a cart with the AMA's on. However if we remove them and carry to the water separetely the boat is no more difficult to roll than our Oasis was (we only use tandems). I used to load and unload the scupper cart in waste deep water, but anymore After I remove the AMA's I just grab the rear aka bar (with no AMA on it) and flip the boat on it's side to insert or remove the scupper cart
FE
Author:  CR Yaker [ Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
recycle wrote:
Wow, I'm surprised you could flip a TI without an aka collapsing. I guess if someone is sitting on the tramp though anything is possible.

I will admit that a couple of times when I was launching my AI, I actually forgot to remove the wheels. I had to remove them once in the water which actually isn't too difficult. The experience makes me wonder if putting your wheels on when you are off-shore before you land might be the easiest thing to do. With the ama's on the boat (and no one on the tramp :wink:) you could sit on the side and slide them in I would think... ? Haven't tried it though.


Bingo, although I only use the heavy duty cart. All depends on your swell conditions. Heavier, cart in place before entering. Light, do it before or after in waist deep water.
Author:  stringy [ Thu Sep 03, 2015 3:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
PaulJ wrote:
1) For those who use the scupper cart with the cradle, whats your secret to putting it on at the end of the day?


You could try this method. Leaving the mast in makes it easier to tilt:


Re when to furl? When the lee AMA is consistently submerged. As a guide, at wind speeds approaching 20 knots, consider furling.
Author:  Haliboo [ Thu Sep 03, 2015 6:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Hi, I had similar question and it was answered here...

http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=55852#p262929

Of course you could always install the cart whilst your TI is upside down....!!! :lol:
Author:  mnmpizza [ Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Stringy: what type of Cart is that? [The metal portion]. Thanks - Shannon

stringy wrote:
PaulJ wrote:
1) For those who use the scupper cart with the cradle, whats your secret to putting it on at the end of the day?


You could try this method. Leaving the mast in makes it easier to tilt:


Re when to furl? When the lee AMA is consistently submerged. As a guide, at wind speeds approaching 20 knots, consider furling.
Author:  stringy [ Fri Sep 04, 2015 5:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Hi Shannon,
I think the guy in the video owns a stainless steel fabricating business and as a sideline has developed some interesting Island accessories. His other clips are worth checking out. I came across this video when I was researching carts. I have no affiliation with him or his business.
I posted the link for the scupper cart fitting method.
Author:  stringy [ Fri Sep 04, 2015 6:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Haliboo wrote:

Of course you could always install the cart whilst your TI is upside down....!!! :lol:


Good one Haliboo!
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Author:  PaulJ [ Fri Sep 04, 2015 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Thats good stuff, thanks for the video on the cart and the advice on furling.

I'm not sure what my wife will think about the "sail it till it flips in order to install the cart" procedure though :lol: :lol: :lol:
Author:  Haliboo [ Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:09 am ]
Post subject:  New TI owner, 2 questions and the story of our capsize
Stringy, I just couldn't help myself!



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