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Another new TI mast snaps
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=49452		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  dogmom [ Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:37 am ]
Post subject:  Another new TI mast snaps
We bought a new TI about 2 months ago and have been enjoying playing around with since. We are in So. Florida, so we haven't had any big winds to test it out. On Saturday we headed out on Biscayne Bay with 12 knot winds and 2 foot waves. We were about 1.5 miles out of the marina heading upwind when the mast catastrophically failed. Mr. dogmom said it sounded like a rifle shot. He jumped forward and pulled the mast out and was able to roll up the sail. Unfortunately, we only brought out one mirage drive since the winds were decent enough. So I pedaled us back to the marina. We drove right to the dealer and they have given us a loaner mast from their rental fleet.

The mast snapped about 8 inches above the drum. The break is almost perfectly straight. I'll email a picture to anyone interested if you send me your address.

I am concerned that there is a manufacturing flaw on the new masts. I was surprised to come onto the forum and see 2 other masts that failed, all on new boats. I am thinking that I would prefer an older mast that is proven rather than get another 'new' mast that could fail again.
Author:  mkrawats [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 7:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
Wow. In only 12 knots of wind? Was the top of your mast bending appropriately when under pressure? Do you believe that Hobie may have add something new to the new TI masts that could weaken its strength? Rivets? Screws?

In heavier wind, my 2010 TI's mast will bend leeward to relieve pressure. This is a greatly appreciated safety feature. Good luck w/Hobie's Warranty Dept and let us know how it goes.
Author:  Tom Kirkman [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
Carbon tubes are neither machined nor extruded. They are cut and laid by hand with some mechanical processes to wrap and pressure the prepeg prior to curing. There is a great deal of hand labor involved and it is not impossible for somebody to do something wrong in any step of the process which may result in a defective mast. Thankfully it's not common and your mast is almost certainly the exception rather than the rule.

Get a new mast and use it with confidence.
Author:  mmiller [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
Yes, File a claim. If something is wrong with production, we will sort it out. Does happen sometimes. You get a bad run. We have our supplier reviewing.
Author:  dogmom [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
We are new to the Hobie TI so I'm not sure what you mean by "bending appropriately". The mast was bending over as it always does. Mr. dogmom, being an old wrestler, fancied that maybe he pulled too hard on the main sheet. :)

Our dealer has the mast so you guys should be seeing it soon.
Author:  tonystott [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
We all know that wrestlers seem stronger than they really are ( :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: ), but I can guarantee that NOBODY could put enough pressure on the mast by pulling on the mainsheet to damage the mast!
Author:  dougc405 [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 7:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
Welcome to the club. I'm still a bit gun shy with my new mast. I find myself furling the sail in conditions where I would not have before. Hopefully, I'll get over it.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 4
Author:  fusioneng [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
I suspect there maybe a couple recent masts out there that were flawed. In general the TI masts are very strong and reliable. I've been running my TI's now for 3 1/2 years now with massive sails 265 sq. ft) with no issues at all. That's way over 5000 sailing miles. I've had all up on many occasions on downwind runs in over 20 mph winds where my TI was able to sustain over 18 mph. I think if there was a general weakness in the mast design, i would have snapped mine a long time ago. I suspect your broken mast had some manufacturing flaw, and was a very rare exception. You will likely never break another one so I wouldn't be concerned about the mast, just have fun with the boat, they really are quite durable.
Yours are the only 2 masts I have read about that have broken for no apparent reason since the TI's came out. A few others have broke, but I suspect more as a result of another catastrophic failure and resultant damage (ie.. Capsize or xbar failure).
Hope this sets your mind at ease.
Bob
Author:  aussieonyak [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
I've had a TI since March. Never had it out in really strong winds - the highest around 20 mph. The first few times out sailing the bend in the top of the mast was scary looking up from the bottom - it seemed like it was ready to snap in 10-15 mph but of course it didn't and I have gradually gotten used to it bending. My previous sailing was only with aluminum masts and they don't bend like these do. :shock:
I'm sure your first mast was just one of the very small % that fail. At least you had a safe ending and everyone was ok - thank goodness for the mirage drives !!
Barry
Author:  tonystott [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
As I have a halyard to the masthead for raising my 360 degree white light, tensioned by a bungee cord, I get to see excatly how much my mast bends under wind pressure. I have not seen more than a 5 inch bend even in extreme conditions. This is the normal function of an unstayed mast.
Author:  dogmom [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
tonystott wrote:
We all know that wrestlers seem stronger than they really are ( :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: ), but I can guarantee that NOBODY could put enough pressure on the mast by pulling on the mainsheet to damage the mast!


Ha! I suggested to him that maybe Hobie would want to employ him to come out and yank all all their masts for quality control! :lol:
Author:  rotorhead [ Thu Oct 03, 2013 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
The TI mast seems to me to be at least as sturdy as my "skinny" windsurfer masts, and we beat the hell out of those things. They generally only break if (as already mentioned) there is a defect, or damage (hitting the reef during a heavy wipeout on a wave), or age (generally they will begin to "creak" at the boom area). I've never worried about the bend as just rigging a windsurfer sail puts a tremendous bend in the mast, more than what I've seen with the TI in moderate winds (below 18 kts).

As with any built in this fashion, avoid any kind of hard impact, like dropping the mast on a hard concrete curbside. A minor ding along the barrel is a surefire way to end a mast's life.
Aloha,
RH
Author:  NOHUHU [ Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
I agree with the spirit of this comparison, but Windsurfers have a flexible base do they not?

Image

The TI has a monohull style stepped base, with an additional fulcrum point about a foot higher (at the bearing plate). So I tend to believe that our 90 sq ft sail creates higher load forces, and they are distributed differently. Enough to plow 600lb of boat and crew on a thrill ride. :twisted:

Obviously, that's no excuse for them to break, so I still agree with your defect theory. At the very least, something ELSE on the TI should break before the mast.

Rotor - Did I hear that you experienced a mast failure recently?
Author:  rotorhead [ Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
NH2-

1. Regarding windsurfers- yes, they use a flexible tendon-style universal. My point was simply that the windsurfer mast itself bends considerably to fit the curved leech, and the mast also bends tremendously when sailing. Watch a few wrecks at Hookipa; I'm amazed more masts don't break there! BL: These things are strong.

My assumption was that hobie used some of the same manufacturers that make windsurfing masts, as the ones I have are so similar. 90 square feet is the size of my light wind windsurfing sail (8.3m), rigged on a 4.9m mast.

2. No, I have not had a mast failure. Just trying to add some experience here from another platform. My TI is just fine; however I am not a speed junkie or performance addict - I'm happy to troll along at 4-6 knots all day.

I see your point - there is a stress riser at/just above the TI mast step, which is something that windsurfers don't have. If that's where all the failures are occurring (and how many do we know of?) then I withdraw my comment.

-RH
Author:  Tom Kirkman [ Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another new TI mast snaps
I'm not sure what the deadlift capacity of the TI mast is, but a 5 inch bend from straight isn't likely to be anywhere close to it.
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