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Recondition Sails?
http://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=29973		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Jman6631 [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Recondition Sails?
Is it possible to recondition sails to get them crisp again?
Author:  dregsfan [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Yes. Try these folks.

http://sailcare.com/
Author:  Jman6631 [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Hey thanks! Looks promising.

Any idea if it is possible to do an acceptable job myself?
Author:  wildlatin [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Ah! a 'black art', arcane topic only known to secret societies of sail processing insiders which must be only in their hands? I'm not saying that professional processing is bad but I believe though it is polymer science; it is not rocket science...

I think part of the reason is that sailing in our society has been an activity of those with let's say 'discriminatory resources'- why fix something when you can just buy new ones? Or why take the time out of sailing to mess with sail maintenance?

This is not ignoring that synthetic fibers stretch and are degraded by UV, sail materials and designs improve over time, etc.

I will be experimenting with application of water-based organic polymers to older Dacron or generic polyester sails for sealing, improved 'lay', water and UV resistance.

Practically, most products will likely have to be carefully applied with proper personal protective equipment in controlled conditions after specific surface preparation- nothing where the sail can be dunked in a bucket of solution, hung up and the result is a 'like-new' sail.

Thus, any sail renewal process will not be for everyone but with limited resources and the high cost of new sails I believe there may be products soon marketed which will make it more feasible.

I will post progress when available.
Author:  Sail Revolution [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
wildlatin wrote:

I think part of the reason is that sailing in our society has been an activity of those with let's say 'discriminatory resources'- why fix something when you can just buy new ones? Or why take the time out of sailing to mess with sail maintenance?


I would argue that this process is not "sail maintenance". Sail maintenance is washing, drying and repairing as needed. There is no amount of goo that one can apply that will repair stretched panels and broken fibers. The crispy feel of a new sail is really not the ultimate goal, it's an indicator, the shape of the sail is more important. Crispy=new=not stretched out. A stretched out crispy sail will not make a boat point noticeably higher, or be noticeably faster.

I'd save my resources for a new sail.
Author:  srm [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Surf City Catamarans wrote:
There is no amount of goo that one can apply that will repair stretched panels and broken fibers. The crispy feel of a new sail is really not the ultimate goal, it's an indicator, the shape of the sail is more important. Crispy=new=not stretched out. A stretched out crispy sail will not make a boat point noticeably higher, or be noticeably faster.

I'd save my resources for a new sail.


I agree 100%. You could roll epoxy resin all over your sail and make it crispy as a brick. It's not going to change the fact that your sail is 15 years old, the tack is stretched down to the trampoline, and the draft is blown out. The level of crispiness is the sail's odometer, but the shape is really what's important.


sm
Author:  fastcat [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 12:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
I also agree, it is all about shape. Otherwise why all the ways to shape a sail. When a sail is professionally refurbished, they re-cut and sew. :wink:
Author:  Jman6631 [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Holy smokers, what an awesome and unexpected can-o-worms, spoken of in hushed and reverent tones....... :lol: :shock:

My original sails are undoubtedly stretched and likely "blown." But, how would I know, this being my first set with no benefit of side by side comparison. I just got a quote form sailcare for ~$150 to recondition my main and jib. With no apparent alternative I'll go there.

Thanks to all for a highly valuable education!
Author:  MBounds [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Image
Author:  Roy [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 11:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
So how much would it cost to recut the sail and bring the pocket back to origonal specs? It would make sense to me that if you are going to spend $150 bucks and end up with sails that look nice but don't perform, depending on cost it would make sense to have the sail shape repaired at the same time as having it looking good.
Author:  Sue2 [ Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Sailcare does a wonderful job reviving older sails.

HOWEVER......!!!!

You should be aware that the process does shrink the sails somewhat. We had our sails done several years ago, and several friends did also. We noticed that, after cleaning, the battens stuck out the ends of the pockets several inches. It messes you up a bit if you use draft gauges, or if your batten tie line is short.

We don't race, so this was not a big issue. I could see how racers may not want to make the trade. (But generally, racers would buy a new set of sails, I guess.)

Just wanted to make you folks aware.

Oh, and you will probably also lose stuck-on decals like the "16" in a circle near the top, and your tell-tales. Be prepared to replace. The printing on the "Hobie" sewn-on label near the downhaul will fade to nearly unreadable.

I am not putting down SailCare in any way. It gives new life to well used sails, and we were happy with the result. These are just things that people may want to be aware of.

-Sue
Erie, PA
Author:  Jman6631 [ Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Thanks Roy, I didn't mention it but was under the understanding that sailcare makes minor repairs as part of their process. I guess if they aren't major they're included but if it's something big then there will likely be an additional charge. But I'm not sure if completely reshaping them and bringing them back into something close to a factory spec is what they do, at least not intentionally.

Thanks also Sue2, I guess that while shrinking the sails is not at all desirable there is a bit of a benefit in that it at least partially reduces the stretch that accompanied the loss of crispiness, too? Again, while not bringing them back into factory spec or anything and having battens stick out that much is a concern, some reduction in stretch is ultimately probably a good thing? Thanks especially for the reality check on expectations.....

I'm not a performance racer, I just like to go fast with my friends and family. If the 150 clams improves the performance of my ~30 y.o. sails then I'll be happy, protruding battens or not. :wink:
Author:  aschaffter [ Mon Aug 30, 2010 9:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Unless something has changed, a few years ago, Sailcare stopped accepting Hobie sails for their re-resin process. They had a problem with stitching on the batten pockets shrinking or something like that and had to eat a number of sails. I didn't see anything about it on their website, however.
Author:  Jman6631 [ Tue Aug 31, 2010 5:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
Wow, that's interesting. I got a quote from them and everything. I'll get back with them to verify and will post their reply.
Author:  Jman6631 [ Tue Aug 31, 2010 7:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Recondition Sails?
UPDATE

SailCare DOES work on Hobie sails. Here is a direct quote from Jerry, a real good guy:

"We do work on Hobie sails. What happened was a customer sent their sails into us for cleaning and some repair. We handle over 5,000 sails a year and it can get pretty confusing if we did not have a form of identifying each sail. So, as is the practice at any sail loft I have ever been in, we mark the customers last name and the invoice number at the head with a black permanent marker. This customer went crazy on us and demanded we replace the sail or they would sue us for defacing private property...If we new anything about business we would bar code the sails then we would know what was going on...We need to step into the business world and get with it, etc., etc. She went on and on.

Hobie sails all have plastic numbers and insignia and will not most of the time survive cleaning. We can remove them or replace them. The husband had said remove them, she said she was not consulted with this decision and we were way out of line. We have been cleaning and building sails for over 25 years, I never had a customer talk to me like that. It was a knee jerk reaction on my part but I refused to handle any Hobie sails from that point on. Then at the request of some long time customers I relented and we are back to doing Hobie sails."


So, for anyone interested, looks like a green light from SailCare. Hope it helps.
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