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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:47 am 
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:38 am
Posts: 8
I'm looking at getting an outback or revo...they look like well engineered boats and a lot of fun. In doing my research I've seen some criticism with regard to the sail, though overall I understand there is great satisfaction and fun to be had with the sail. My concern is that the issue has not been addressed. So then I see the jam cleat for the rudder, and I wonder if that is an area of concern that has not been addressed. My concern:

A jam cleat does not seem the ideal method for keeping the rudder seems better for cases where a line would need to be held in any of an infinite number of positions. The rudder position is basically in a binary state, either on (down) or off (up), thus having a stop for the rudder deployment line would seem to make more sense (like a clip to just hold the handle for when it is deployed) than a jam cleat. My specific concern is that eventually the line could fray based on the friction imparted by the cleat. And since the line weaves through the boat, I'm not sure how easy it would be to replace. Separately, I'm also interested to know if the cleat works effectively when the line is wet.

Am I overthinking this? I'm sure the jam cleat works well (right?), just concerned about longevity. Any thoughts?

PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:55 pm 
Site Admin

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 11946
Location: Oceanside, California
Yes, you are over thinking this I believe. The rudder down cleat works and works well.

The boats expand and contract with temperature and that changes the length of line required to pull the rudder down tight... lines stretch and become looser over time. The cleat allows a tight rudder down every time... no adjustments needed.

Cleats for sails are not recommended on the kayaks. Kayaks are a bit tippy due to the sail size, so holding the line is highly recommended.

Matt Miller
Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 5:45 pm 
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:17 pm
Posts: 670
Location: Auckland NZ
I can't think what criticism of the sail you are referring to :o :? - these boats make excellent sailers and the sails are well cut, well sized for the boats, generate enough power (in the light winds for which they are designed) to be able to move the boats along at a perfectly acceptable pace, and allow the boats to be sailed upwind as well as downwind (unlike many/most aftermarket kayak sails which are really only for cross- or down-wind sailing).

Of course, on the basis that nothing is perfect, tweaks have been developed to improve sailing performance; such things as:
* Using blocks to ease friction in the mainsheet;
* Moving the sheeting point from its usual position on the rear padeye;
* Staying the mast to prevent mast bend/improve sail shape;
* Adding a jib;
* Adding roller reefing
* Adding outriggers for extra stability.

Some of these tweaks are "advisable"; others are very much non-essential and a decision to spend money on them would be very much down to personal preference.

Another factor is that some of the Hobie Mirage Drive kayaks are undoubtedly better sailers than others based primarily on hull shape. The best in my experience is the Adventure particularly with the optional daggerboard; I haven't sailed the Revo, Pro Angler or Sport but I have sailed the Outback and the doubles: their sailing performance is not as good as the Adventure.

In essence I would contend that there is nothing at all wrong with the performance of the stock standard sail straight out of the box on a stock standard Mirage Drive kayak and I strongly suspect that a Hobie Mirage Drive Kayak with the standard sail is the best off-the-shelf kayak sailing offering currently available on the market.

I have certainly had a huge amount of use and enjoyment out of my Hobie kayak sailing equipment (1xAdventure, 1xAI, 1xOutfitter, 1xAI sail, 2xkayak sails, 1x kayak jib, 1xstandard mast; 1x stayed mast; 2xdaggerboard)... :D :D :D

PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 6:36 pm 
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:38 am
Posts: 8
Thanks for the responses!

Interesting answer on the shrinking and contracting of the line...ok, good enough...i guess if there were problems with the line fraying, I'd have found that issue by now!

Regarding the sail, yeah, a couple of those issues are exactly what I was referring too :D But that is not going to deter me. This just seems like such a great way for me to try out sailing...I've always wanted to do it, but on my own terms, and I don't have a lot of money, a lot of storage or a waterfront property...this is going to be a great start! It's amazing how unanimous the praise is for these yaks and the mirage drive...

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