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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Posts: 134
I couldn't get the images to come through,so I just listed links (sorry!).

I decided to try a cheap experiment to help my Revo 13, 11, and Oasis track better while paddling without the rudder deployed.

I found these rubber skegs from ebay (less than $4 shipped to NY from China). I cleaned the area with rubbing alcohol, and then used silicone to glue these on. I kept them close to the keel on a flat area, and the keel helps to protect them from obstacles. On the 11 and Oasis, the keels are shorter in height so these will stick out. I did use a heat gun to soften the rubber and then applied Gorilla tape on the edges of the bases to hold the skegs firmly in place overnight as the silicone cured.

As far as testing on the water- works like a charm! No corrective strokes needed in windy conditions up to 10 mph so far. And the best part is, these have minimal if any effect on steering response as far as I could tell.

So Hobie- how about molding in 2 surfboard/paddleboard skeg mounts moving forward so customers can opt to add some skegs in if they choose?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2NzVSZUs4VHFqdUU/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2ZmdpcWllcWpUb3M/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2LTlJeXVYclNqMm8/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2QXh4MHJON3dVSDA/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2RHgwb0dLT3k3ZHc/view?usp=sharing


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:48 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 11, 2013 8:23 pm
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Location: Laguna Vista, TX
What you have done is very interesting. Over the past four years I have broken a couple rudder control lines while on the water, or had to paddle when I got caught in some real skinny water and couldn't even deploy the rudder. It was a real circus trying to maneuver my Oasis to safety. I have a couple questions that I hoping you can shed some light on:

1. Have you tried using the mirage drive with the rudder in the stowed position? If so, how does your Oasis track?

2. Under normal use when you are using your rudder and mirage drives, have you noticed any reduction in speed with the two skegs installed?

Good work, staktup. Really innovative.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 7:05 pm 
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Thanks Tag.

Paddling the Oasis w/o the rudder before the addition of the 2 skegs was similar to paddling my Revo 13, but prob. better than the 11. A slight breeze made tracking straight challenging.

Under normal use I could not "feel" any difference in speed and effort due to increased drag, but never quantified this. Where I typically launch is a tight space with many submerged and exposed boulders, so it helps me navigate the minefield w/o using the rudder and yet I can still swing the yak around 180 degrees quickly to paddle in to the dock backwards. I do this to make the next launch easier.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:10 pm 
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I would also like to see a "skeg slot" akin to the daggerboard slots on the adventure and revo 16 in the rear tankwell so that you could slot in, remove, or even alter the depth of a skeg if required. This would vastly improve the revo 16's hybrid nature.

I wouldn't want a permanent fixture as I would hit it on the bottom in some of the areas I kayak.

Other aids to paddling are thigh straps and even add ballast to you drive plug to reduce twitchiness and aid confidence in edging. Learning efficient paddle strokes also goes a long way.

I also use the deeper plug from an outback in my revo 16 rather than the original shallow one. This gives more volume for ballast, provides a top surface above water level to put stuff on and helps to brace your heel against


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 7:42 am 
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pretty neat idea Staktup!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:54 pm 
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Jcanracer wrote:
pretty neat idea Staktup!


Thanks man. The appearance and function reminds me of a surfboard. Can track straight while paddling but turn quickly.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:11 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:07 pm
Posts: 13
staktup wrote:
I couldn't get the images to come through,so I just listed links (sorry!).

I decided to try a cheap experiment to help my Revo 13, 11, and Oasis track better while paddling without the rudder deployed.

I found these rubber skegs from ebay (less than $4 shipped to NY from China). I cleaned the area with rubbing alcohol, and then used silicone to glue these on. I kept them close to the keel on a flat area, and the keel helps to protect them from obstacles. On the 11 and Oasis, the keels are shorter in height so these will stick out. I did use a heat gun to soften the rubber and then applied Gorilla tape on the edges of the bases to hold the skegs firmly in place overnight as the silicone cured.

As far as testing on the water- works like a charm! No corrective strokes needed in windy conditions up to 10 mph so far. And the best part is, these have minimal if any effect on steering response as far as I could tell.

So Hobie- how about molding in 2 surfboard/paddleboard skeg mounts moving forward so customers can opt to add some skegs in if they choose?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2NzVSZUs4VHFqdUU/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2ZmdpcWllcWpUb3M/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2LTlJeXVYclNqMm8/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2QXh4MHJON3dVSDA/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwVqMFCWUXn2RHgwb0dLT3k3ZHc/view?usp=sharing

Wow, thanks for the tip! I've been frustrated when paddling my Revo13 on local creeks and rivers, as the Revo doesn't track well at all unless the rudder is deployed. This means stowing and deploying my rudder a lot when paddling skinny water or shoals.

What kind of glue or silicone did you use for attachment? Does it seem to be holding up?

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:41 am 
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Well, yesterday I hauled my revo 11 on to a dock and lost one. It performed excellently on this hull like on my Oasis and 13. I think I will now use something tougher like Lexel. Any suggestions would be appreciated!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:32 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
I haven't tried it but 3M's VHB tape may be an option.
There are only a couple of epoxies that actually bond with PE (3M Scotchweld DP8010 or Loctite 3030) but the VHB tape may be strong enough for this application. If it was you could also use VHB + industrial velcro and make the fin removable.
Might be worthwhile trying?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:34 am 
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wonder if you could make up a skeg attached to a lowrance ready transducer cap and bolt to underside instead of plain cap, or over it? maybe a bit far forward. Be a bit of a pain when launching and dragging ashore though.

If using twin skegs how about some flip down ones on side of kayak instead of under? Mounted on ends of a cross tube which you rotate say with cord/bungie to deploy skegs


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 6:18 am 
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Or maybe glue one to a mirage drive plug. Since it would not compromise the hull, it can be screwed or riveted in, and spray foam can be shot inside a small drilled hole to prevent it from getting waterlogged.

The only issue if it even performs well, is carrying around a drivewell plug!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Staktup,
After reading your initial post I was keen to try your mini skeg idea to see how well it improved the tracking while paddling on my Adventure.
I fitted the skegs 2 weeks ago and I’ve done 4 trips with them. The last trip I had a 15 knot crosswind and I agree with you. Wow, what a difference they made! No extra corrective strokes needed and a much better paddling experience, which surprised me!

I used 3M VHB Scotch mounting tape that I had lying around. It was a few years old but still sticky. I cleaned the hull with acetone and stuck the skegs as far aft as possible.
Image
The skeg tips sat short of lowest point of the hull. I can still drag the hull up the boat ramp or onto a jetty without hitting the skegs.
Image
Image

With the kayak unloaded the skeg tips just touch the water...
Image
...but are fully under when sitting in the kayak
Image

The VHB tape has remarkable bonding. I can actually lift the kayak by the skegs. Since fitting though, a couple of edges have lifted slightly. A quick press sticks them back down but a better bond would be good. I researched 3M’s VHB website which recommends a different VHB tape and the use of a primer on low energy plastics like polyethylene. I’ve ordered 5952 VHB tape and Primer 94. I will also follow their prepping instructions using a mix of water and isopropyl alcohol to clean the hull, instead of the acetone I used.
If this doesn’t work long term, I’ll try Scotchweld DP8010 epoxy.

It’s such a good mod I’d even consider through hull fixing if all else fails!
So a big thanks for your idea, which makes a significant improvement in the tracking when conditions aren’t ideal for paddling.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:32 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:48 pm
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Location: Missoula, Montana
Hobie Mirage Drive kayaks have a bit of rocker so they will turn rapidly when using a rudder. As a result, when they are paddled, they don't track as well as most sea kayaks. However, All of the Hobie kayaks track way better than any whitewater kayak. If you spend more time paddling your Hobie, you'll realize that it is easy to keep it going in a straight line. A skeg is unnecessary, will make it harder to maneuver your kayak with a paddle, and eventually is going to get damaged or broken.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:14 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
I used to think the same PMP but just 4 trips with the skegs has convinced me otherwise.
I have nearly 10 years experience mostly paddling Adventure kayaks and what you say about tracking holds true in flat calm conditions but not when the wind gets up. Any strongish crosswind 8knots+ makes it a challenge to paddle in a straight line. The skegs made paddling easy in the 15 knot crosswind I experienced last week. Normally I would have had the rudder down for paddling in those conditions, or put the pedals in, but I was able to paddle normally with rudder up and no doubled up corrective strokes. Paddling with the rudder down is problematic as adjustments have to be made and it catches weed. There was a huge difference in paddling enjoyability. As an experiment I chose different headings by picking various landmarks and was able to paddle straight to them. I also did not notice any disadvantages caused by the skegs with slow speed manouevering or pedaling with the Miragedrive. In fact it felt like I made less rudder adjustments when pedaling than usual, yet was still able to turn tightly when needed.
I am now a big believer in adding skegs and will be experimenting with mounting options. I have found no negatives so far with these skegs.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:39 pm 
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For the revo 16 I made a couple of skegs, one was a repurposed OEM rudder the other a longer one made from an acrylic off cut. These I screwed to a bit of alum square tube each. Padded around top with a bit of foam and wedged them into the daggerboard slot. I was pleasantly surprise not only did it track straighter but also turned better. The keel effect heels the kayak over like sailboat once you start to slide it into a turn, and giving a power assisted edging to it, boosting the turn. Also adds substantial primary stability when at anchor or drifting. Swapping the skeg sizes over, or have non, as preferred. lso can act as a substitute for a drift chute for drifting sideways being centrally located.

Though I do like the small twin skegs tucked up either side of the keel, as not grounding an attached skeg was a concern. Do these rear mounted skegs affect manouverability?

Maybe a breakaway arrangement where you have a backing plate mount more securely attached to the hull then having the blade attached to that with breakaway ties and a small leash of some sort in case of hitting something


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