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PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:43 pm 
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Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Rockland Maine
Hi all,

I have spend the last two weeks learning as much as possible about my new H18.

I have a 78 ( E788 ) cat, with new style EPO rudders. The dagger wells are flanged top and bottom.

I think a previous owner maybe had a funny idea about the main halyard. There is a block with a cam cleat attached to the mast that I haven't seen on any other H18.

Image

https://mega.nz/#!ODABRQ4L!CK8HetpwEYMMMAnoPieFiJJvRuvVjgwHpN0e4HNxVow

Do any of you have some idea of what this might be for? Worth keeping?

Thanks!

-Ted


Last edited by tedcool on Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 4:45 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 7:11 pm
Posts: 5166
Location: Detroit, MI
Definitely not original equipment.

My guess is that the previous owner was having problems with the halyard latch, so they installed this cleat.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 10:25 am
Posts: 3576
Location: Jersey Shore
Agreed. Most likely the previous owner got frustrated with the hook system and looked for another solution. The hook system can take some getting used to and has caused a lot of headaches for some sailors. However, once you figure out how to make it work, it actually works quite well.

That cleat could also have been used if the previous owner sailed solo often and needed a way to make hoisting the main easier - pull the halyard, cleat it off, feed some mainsail into the luff track, pull more halyard, etc.

sm


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 7:40 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Rockland Maine
Thanks guys!

The plastic luff track on the comptip is damaged, and the sail is really hard to raise. I just got a good used one to fix it with. The alu section will be here next week. I think the previous owner didn't know about Sailkote...

The mast has the latch 'flipper' still installed. I guess I should remove it.

Any thoughts on whether the Aussie ring would work better than the regular ( version 2, I guess ) ring?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2018 6:01 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:25 pm
Posts: 157
Location: New Port Richey Fl.
Downhaul system?

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ADDICTION
1989 HOBIE 18 SE/sx wings
HOBIE ALTER SIGNATURE MODEL


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2018 10:14 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 8:21 am
Posts: 328
Location: St. Helena, CA
Hello Ted,
How about a picture of the top of the mast?

I agree with SRM this looks like a main halyard fix for someone that had problems hooking the ring to the hook. If you can add a picture of the top of the mast we can confirm if the hook is missing or altered. I disagree that this is down haul, the block would be inverted if it was used that way plus the line in the block matches the line tied to the halyard ring.

Are you sure this is a 78 or could it be an 88? last 4 of the serial number will confirm. (were black crossbars available in 78?)

Where are you I see snow?

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Corkguy H18, H20, Tiger


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:49 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
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Location: Rockland Maine
Corkguy - You're right - It's an 88 ( E788 )

The top hook is fine. The flipper is still in place - maybe that's the problem!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:11 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
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Location: Rockland Maine
Thanks for the replies guys!

My responses are a bit out of order due to waiting for new user post moderation.

I guess I could keep that stuff there to aid singlehanding. I don't think that's in the plan this year, as we are new to cat sailing. The Rockland harbor is reasonably well protected, but I'm not ready to send my teen age son out alone - yet...

It looks like I might be able to add a small block there and upgrade the downhaul a bit. 4:1 should be cheap and easy.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:13 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:11 pm
Posts: 71
you have to pay attention to what is going on when raising the main. if you do it correctly you can both hear it and feel it lock in or unlock(feel it only on a really windy day) when dropping. I would recommend practicing on a nice quite day a few times. Many silicone lubes are recommended for the sail track. i just use paraffin wax on the bolt rope and lasts for quite awhile. it is also quite cheap.
Yer foto link is already gone


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:43 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
tedcool wrote:
Corkguy - You're right - It's an 88 ( E788 )

The top hook is fine. The flipper is still in place - maybe that's the problem!


Quote:
Locking the Hobie 17/18/20/21 Halyard

It is best to simulate the halyard locking with the mast down so you clearly understand the system. Then, depending on how old the boat is, be sure the hook does not have the old “flopper” stainless piece hanging on the hook. This old device caused difficulty in raising and hooking but would make it easier to release and lower. Also, be sure that the knot tied to the ring is very low profile. A long bowline knot will hit the mast head before the ring gets to the hook. If the ring has a small loop at the top… The line should be passed through the loop and a small knot tied. The knot (when ring and shackle are afixed to the sail) should be facing the mast. This tilts the ring closer to the mast. Then (before attaching halyard shackle to the sail) spin the haylard 3 or 4 times clockwise (looking down on the shackle). This “pre-loads” the halyard line and causes the ring to swing back towards the hook. Keep the boat into the wind and hoist. Should lock easily. To release… fully release the downhaul and outhaul. Partially feed the sail up the luff track. Hoist with the halyard to the top till it stops, hold… rotate the aft of the mast base to starboard, hold the mast rotated, ease the halyard a few feet before releasing the mast. Lower the sail.

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Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
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Hobie Cat USA


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:15 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:06 pm
Posts: 36
Location: Sydney, Australia
Set up with 8:1 downhaul on the mainsail. Anything less than 8:1 and you aren’t getting enough on when it is windy.

With the halyard hook and ring, the Aussie Ring is not strong enough. The ring elongates as it is only 3/16”. You should use a 5mm ring with a nice 1/4” twist shackle. All these are shown on my boats own Facebook page. See link below.

To raise and lower sail easily, do it with the rig tension OFF. Make sure the boat is directly head to wind.

Enjoy.

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John Forbes
Hobie 18 classic
Sail # 490
Boat name: 18@heart
www.hobie18.fun
https://www.facebook.com/Hobie18catamaran/


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:36 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Rockland Maine
I've got the ring with the offset eye.

It seems that Hobie started off using a plain ring and a twist shackle, and then changed to the one piece designs after a few years.

Going back to that as you suggested is an easy experiment. Thanks!

I am planning to flip over the sheave and cleat that's on the mast now and adapt it to a downhaul. I have a few months to look for the rest of the parts to finish it up.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:49 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:06 pm
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Ok. Please also check out all the photo and video albums on my boats Facebook page for lots of neat ideas with boat set up. All my ideas are based around making the boat nicer to sail, less bruising on knees and bums, less torn wetsuits and most importantly a happy crew. If the crew is happy and getting around the boat faster then you will go faster.

Oh yer, I also design it to be faster to rig and unrig. First to the BBQ wins.

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John Forbes
Hobie 18 classic
Sail # 490
Boat name: 18@heart
www.hobie18.fun
https://www.facebook.com/Hobie18catamaran/


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:47 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:06 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Rockland Maine
"First to the BBQ wins"

Mmmm Better than any trophy. Hence the heavy crew! :D

I haven't joined Faceborg. I can see most of the content, I think. I just get pestered to sign up every few clicks.

Your site is a great resource. Interesting to compare your setup with what Berman was running in the early 80's.

I found a posting yesterday that said the comp tip came out mid 80's, so perhaps Berman's advice doesn't consider that factor. Certainly no mention of it that I remember.

You might be a good person to write an updated / revised edition of the H18 Performance manual. Berman and Murray's might participate in publishing and give you a cut. Probably won't make you rich, though...


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:17 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:06 pm
Posts: 36
Location: Sydney, Australia
Thanks. I’ve got the Berman books and others. More for their historical value though. A lot has changed since then with nearly every off the beach cat, the main one being mast rake, and lots of it. The increased mast rake has many knock on effects such as different draft position on the main, centre of effort changes, load on rudders, bow out, sheet harder, jib slot changes, etc all which, if all acted upon in unison, can lead to a smoother ride and more height upwind. But it’s still one of many factors to a faster boat.

In my opinion, the biggest advantage in boat speed, balance, pointing and thus general acceleration comes from good rudders and boards. Hobie have produced up to 11 different rudder shapes since inception to try and make the boat steer better and allow tighter sheeting without stalling the blades. In Australia nearly every H18 uses after market (Finline) rudders or new EPO3 rudders. The Finlines fit the H18 nicely. The EPO3’s need a fair amount of work to suit the H18 rudder assembly as they are originally designed to suit the H16 castings, but their shape and construction is nice.

On the Hobie 18 the stock standard dagger boards need LOTS of work to stop them humming, mainly on the trailing/aft edge and also by reducing slop in the trunk/case. In Australia nearly every boat uses after market (Finline) dagger boards to ensure a smoother (quieter) ride and thus better performance upwind. Start sanding down those trailing edges to an even, sharp edge.

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John Forbes
Hobie 18 classic
Sail # 490
Boat name: 18@heart
www.hobie18.fun
https://www.facebook.com/Hobie18catamaran/


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