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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 11:44 am
Posts: 42
Location: Traverse City, MI.
Should have known better but it was going so fast it was so fun. Left the shore in light wind, saw a front moving across the lake and went for it, must have picked up 25-30 and just started screaming on a reach, got over powered and didn't know what to do. Traveler all the way out, main sheet out all the way and still light on the hull, went to fuel jib and the furlwr line snapped.
Got pointed dead up wind for a moment but tried to ignore the jib and the bows couldn't come around. Started sheeting in my main to prepare to come around without a Big Bang and caught the next guest and took off and then went over. Slipped down the tramp right between the boom and the wing. Immediately swam around the Steven to climb up on the hull, but in that 15 seconds I watched the boat turtle. Happened in a flash.
Is that because it was so windy or so the wings help roll it over?
What do you do with a turtled boat.
We drifted toward shore, I let out the windward stay hoping the mast would come free, affraid it would break the company tip in the shallows. But the mast stayed intact, as we blew closer to shore the boat started coming up a little. I popped the rudders up and started pointing the bow to the wind. After that I forget what I was doing but the wind blew the boat back upright. Mast was down, I unhooked the correct stay. So far I can't find any broken parts, just a lost Cotter pin and circle clip. Mast tip is full of sand.
That was a great fun 5 minute sail


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 4:55 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 5:22 am
Posts: 584
Location: Columbus, Indiana
Shroud extenders is what I use and a large righting bag from Colorado Bag Co. with an old H16 or H14 main sheet block to pick up that heavy bag.

Consult with Don from Salty Dog Marine to order those shroud extenders and a new set of shorten shrouds. :wink:

You may also try adding swimming noodles under your wing tramps for both flotation and to keep the wings from garbing the water from a large wave. It requires many to fill the void and they last a few years if covered.

Good luck, Bill

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 6:21 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2003 7:14 pm
Posts: 458
Location: West MI
although I don't try to flip the boat over, it happens. I have added pool noodles in the wings like Bill said. That and a good righting line with two people and you should be OK if your mast is sealed. I have a all aluminum mast and a comp-tip mast and I found the comp-tip mast turtles faster. It tapers smaller at the top so less displacement when in the water.

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DVL 1989 H-18 Worlds Boat, Magnum Wings & Spinnaker

dale.vanlopik"at"att"dot"net


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:08 am 
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Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 11:44 am
Posts: 42
Location: Traverse City, MI.
Mine turtled as soon as it flipped over.
Put pool noodles inside the wings?
How does a shroud extender work?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:42 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:15 pm
Posts: 524
Location: Buffalo, NY
I believe that shroud extenders don't work on a Hobie 18. My understanding is that a Hobie 14/16 has a captive mast base, so you can let the shrouds go loose and all it does is let the mast flop around. However, the H18 mast just rests on the mast step. If your shrouds go slack, the mast pops off of the base and then there's no getting it back on, so you've essentially dismasted the boat. If it's flooded, all the more trouble in getting the boat back upright and back to shore.

Shroud extenders are basically just a foot long extension cable that's pinned to the shroud and to the anchor plate. When you pull a release pin, the shroud comes un-pinned from the anchor and the extension goes taught, giving your upper shroud an extra foot of length and allowing the mast to slop over to one side as you work on righting the boat. That way it's easier to right the boat because you're not fighting the mast as much.

The boat should not turtle immediately, and if it does I'd say that either the mast has a leak or the wind on the trampoline & wing forced it over further. Recovering a boat from a turtled position is extremely difficult, particularly with a flooded mast, and usually requires powerboat assistance. One trick to get the boat to roll over back on it's side is to sit/stand on the stern of one hull with your crew and cause it to sink down in the water and then try to rock your weight back and forth, trying to get the boat to "cartwheel" back onto it's side. I've never done it myself, and I think it works better on a H14/16. If your mast is flooded, it won't work.

I'm not sure if the wings make the boat easier to turtle as far as the added weight is concerned, and I tend to doubt that. However, it does provide more "sail area" when the boat is on its side for the wind to force the boat to turtle. I would absolutely check your mast for leaks, as that is a guaranteed way to turtle the boat quickly. As far as avoiding turtling the boat, you need to get your weight off the upper hull quickly after it goes over and rotate the boat so that the bows are pointing into the wind, or 45 degrees off the wind with the wind blowing on the top of the trampoline and wings, to help right the boat and prevent it from blowing the boat over further. I believe where Bill and DVL are talking about putting pool noodles in the wings, they're talking about putting it between the wing tramp and the lacing. A mast float is also a good solution as it is pretty much guaranteed to avoid turtling, but it also makes righting the boat more difficult. I think Hobie has stopped making some of the mast floats, but I've also heard of people tying pool noodles to their mast for the same effect.

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'79 H18 standard 'Rocketman II' sail #14921


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:15 pm
Posts: 78
I have extenders... and I spliced up a simple dyneema line that circles the front beam and the port diamond wire base, and then the front beam and the left diamond wire base. There's effectively no stretch in dyneema and I can just *barely* clip the spliced eyes together, but there's still sufficient slack for the mast to rotate freely.

I can right the boat with crew, but I haven't practiced enough to feel confident about righting without crew yet, so I appreciate the extra assurance of the extenders. The real benefit to the extenders is that little bit of extension on the top-side shroud allows the topside hull to flop just a little further so that the weight of that top hull is working towards righting the boat, instead of working against you.

I have yet to turtle my H18 with either the comp tip mast or the all-aluminum stick which I prefer. The time I turtled my old Spirit 17 with the leaky mast, we ended up down-rigging (up-rigging, perhaps, since it was upside down) the mast and getting a tow back to shore. Righting almost 30-feet of water-filled lever arm isn't easy!

Randii


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:24 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2003 7:11 pm
Posts: 5156
Location: Detroit, MI
SabresfortheCup wrote:
My understanding is that a Hobie 14/16 has a captive mast base, so you can let the shrouds go loose and all it does is let the mast flop around.
The 14 and 16 don't have captive mast bases. The 17 theoretically does, but most people I know remove the pin after stepping the mast - if you dismast with the pin in place, there's a good chance you'll break the front crossbar.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 6:48 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:46 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Ft wayne, IN
It seems to me the wings do make my H18 turtle faster. My idea is when the boat is on its side the wing in the water kind of acts like a brake so the hull cant slide sideways on the surface , the wind on the tramp and wing push the mast under quicker. Now thats just my idea but every time I have fliped my 18 its turtled, my mast is sealed and every time it turtled my crew of one and I have been able to right the boat, just have the one righting line tied to the striker and stand on hull and lean back, takes a few min. but the boat will come back up on its side then right easaly once the sail clears the water.

had a H16 for 25 years and never had much of a problem with that and H18 with out wings for 5 and same thing not sure it ever turtled it , the one thing about the H18 with wings is it does have the comp tip so taht could be some of the difference also. One more thing sailing in Northern In in october is nothing new but this season its been amazing , with such warm weather and water havent even got the wet suit out yet, feels good to get a bit wet.. Jay


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:05 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 10:20 pm
Posts: 124
Location: South Boardman, Mi
It took me around 450 lbs to bring my H18 over from turtle by sending the crew to the back of the hulls. Not sure if the wings make the boat go turtle faster, but they sure make rotating the boat into the wind to right a bit harder.

Make sure your mast is sealed. A leaky mast falls somewhere between safety issue and giant PITA, depending on where you are when you flipped.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:12 am 
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Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 9:49 am
Posts: 226
Location: Eastern PA
The boat is pivoting around the floating hull and any extra weight on the top hull will push down against whatever floatation is keeping it up.


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