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Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
http://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1749		 Page 2 of 2
Author:  J_Eaton [ Mon Jun 04, 2012 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
sideshore wrote:
Screws are frozen and I think I'm getting some leakage
May not be the source of your leak? I'd do a leak test first.
Author:  sunvista [ Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
Benfrancis wrote:
I just looked at a pic of one piece gudgeon, do I have to use the holes supplies in the gudgeon and fight with old screws ?

Can I put mounting holes wherever I want in the gudgeon ?
Where in the world would you put new holes in the one piece gudgeon? Or do you mean can you relocate the gudgeon on the transom? The short answer to that is no. The gudgeon uses a tapped aluminum backing plate that is not much bigger than the gudgeon itself. At least on the older boats.
Author:  bluesman [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:05 am ]
Post subject:  One piece gudgeon = lots, and lots of cutomizing work
I just installed a on piece Gudgeon and it was a long and painfull process.

Let me start by saying, I have a lot of experience working with metal using hand tools as well as most machine shop machines, and what I went throught to install one one-piece gudgeon onto my hobie 16 with good original stock gudgeon holes was rediculous.

I read several form posts (as well as the direction that came with the casting) that lead me to belive that I would simply run a larger drill bit throught the holes and be all set. If I had used an oversized drill to open up the holes enough to allow me to install the screws it would have broken through the casting in several places and weakened it to the point of being unusable..

I had to use a larger drill bit, pressed sideways to remove material very carfully on an angle to allow all 6 of the screws to fit. I also had to dremel away a ton aluminum from the casting where the bushings attach, to allow the screw heads to fit flush with the casting when tightened. I used the composite wheels for this task.

When done the casting looked like a hacked mess, and needed to be painted to hide the dozen or so custom mods. The entire cusomizing took allmost 2 hours just for one gudgeon. It should certainly go faster next time, and if I had a milling machine it would have taken 15 minutes, but sheesh what a project!
Author:  sunvista [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
You forgot the part about how your rudder castings foul the new gudgeon when turned lock-to-lock unless you also grind away some of the aluminum casting. The European casting is smaller or thinner or something. I made this change because my boat was missing a gudgeon when I bought it but I usually try to talk people out of it. Rule #1: if it works...don't fix it.
Author:  bluesman [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:27 am ]
Post subject:  One piece gudgeon of Death
Oh Yes, I just found this out when I went to install the rudder casting after I bedded the gudgeon in practically permanent 3M 5200.

I was forced to merrily grind away tons of my lower casting in order to clear the heads of the screws. On a positive note ther is plenty of aluminum to grind away.

I sure wish I had know that over 2 hours of machining operations were going to be required to install this thing, and the funny part it that the bushings in the gudgeon are made of plastic (and not replaceable as far as I know) so when they wear our I will have to rip out and replace the whole thing! I can hardly wait!
Author:  ASDASC [ Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
So, I am assuming that when they designed the one peice gudgeions that they didn't intend it to be used as a retrofit on older boats, correct?

It seems that with a lost sand casting process someone could make up a 'retrofit casting' to replace existing one with a better design and easier installation, or even just mill it. Does lack of volume prohibit this?
Author:  sunvista [ Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
ASDASC wrote:
So, I am assuming that when they designed the one peice gudgeions that they didn't intend it to be used as a retrofit on older boats, correct?

It seems that with a lost sand casting process someone could make up a 'retrofit casting' to replace existing one with a better design and easier installation, or even just mill it. Does lack of volume prohibit this?
It wasn't designed for the US boat or the North American market at all. It was transferred directly over from the H-16 sold in Europe. In fairness though, everywhere I've seen it sold comes with a disclaimer that it is not a direct replacement. Co-incidently many boats I've seen with this backfit also have an inspection port at the stern. I'm guessing a lot of transoms have been mangled in the process. The truth is that there is really nothing wrong with the original design. It is a big chunk of stainless steel and very sturdy. This one piece gudgeon buys you no improvement whatsoever that I can see.
Author:  rattle 'n hum [ Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: One piece gudgeon of Death
bluesman wrote:
......and the funny part it that the bushings in the gudgeon are made of plastic (and not replaceable as far as I know) so when they wear our I will have to rip out and replace the whole thing! I can hardly wait!


There are plastic bushings in the one-piece gudgeon?
Author:  Tim H16 [ Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
My gudgeon bolts have gotton to the point that enlarging the bolts, etc. is not working and I need to bolt through the transoms and put SS fender washers and locknuts on from the inside. I am still using the two piece gudgeons.

I was planning on using the Hobie 4" hatch cover kit (5352W).

Bill Mattson wrote a good article in On The Wire entitled: Do-It-Yourself: Installing Deck Ports

http://www.thebeachcats.com/news/29/installing-deck-ports/

I wasn't sure where is the best place to locate the ports between the stern and aft pylon? I also want to reach the aft pylon from inside the hull.
Author:  Hobie Nick [ Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
If you ever want to remove something, do not use 3M5200. If you have a mechanical fastener there is no need for this kind of bonding. Any non-silicone sealant will work fine to keep water out and allow you to remove the part.

From having owned used boats most of my adult life I will say using 5200 is a great way to make the new owner of your boat ticked off.
Author:  MBounds [ Thu Jul 12, 2012 2:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Advice on converting to one piece gudgeon.
True dat.

5200 = forever

Don't ever use that stuff if you ever want to get it apart again.
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