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 Post subject: Wave Racers
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:33 am 
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I am in the process of writing a request to change a rule with IHCA to allow for ALL Hobie supplied rudders to be used on the Hobie Wave, not the the Stock one they come with. This would of course, allow for racing and EPO rudders to be used.
Any comments? I plan to submit this next week. Contact me xanderwess@yahoo.com
There are other items that have been substituted in place of the OEM parts, but after lengthy discussions and explainations, I am not in favor of any of them except the rudder change for IHCA class racing rules.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:22 pm 
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Do alternate rudders offer any perceivable advantage? Why would someone want a different rudder?

I don't want to encourage upgrading to something which would handicap us "factory stock" sailors; but at the same time, I don't want to exclude someone because they already switched out.

Both the rudders and tiller arms are significantly different between EZ-Lock and old style set-ups. But I don't know if there's a particular advantage either way. There is a weight difference, also.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:47 pm 
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I cannot speak to anything but the flex of the stock vs. the race rudders or the EPO. Every other class allows an 'upgrade' to stiffer rudders, and since they do on the 14,16,17,18,Tiger,20,21 blah blah blah, why not on the Wave too if we're getting a real live racing class together? My fear is that being a full sized adult (200lbs) I have snapped my share of rudders on my 14 and 16 and don't want to be victim on my Wave as well.
Size wise, I would assume they are the same, weight wise would have to be very comparable.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:58 pm 
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Wow, it's hard for me to imagine snapping a rudder, but I guess that shows my inexperience in hard-core Hobie racing. Was it from hitting something or from stress while steering?

The new plastic rudders do seem kinda thin and flimsy, compared to the old heavy fiberglass ones. But I'm not sure if that means the old ones would be more brittle, and the new ones are more resilient?

As long as it's a durability issue, not a performance issue, I don't see any objection. The Wave is a pretty neutral-helm boat anyway.

Would you have to change to the old style castings to accomodate the alternate rudders? The EZ-Lock plastic castings couldn't handle anything thicker than the new stock rudders.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 6:14 pm 
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No, the rudders are the same size and all that, just made stiffer. Don't get me wrong, the stiffer the rudder the more perfomance, but yea, all the 16 guys have experienced a snapped rudder at one time or another and the 20 guys have too now that I think about it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 6:51 pm 
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I think I should clarify something. Do you realize there are already two STOCK Wave rudders, depending on the age of the boat?

The old style rudder (more like the 14's, 16's, etc...) was hard fiberglass, thick and heavy, with metal castings and cams.

About 4 years ago, Hobie switched to the EZ-Lock rudders, which are much thinner, lighter and plastic. The EZ-Lock castings are black plastic; there are no cams, and the tiller arms are much shorter.

I have the EZ-Locks on my 2006 model. There would be no way to put the old stock fiberglass rudders on my boat, without changing castings and everything. So I doubt I could put "racing" or EPO rudders on it either, unless they made a separate thinner version which could fit in the plastic castings.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 7:20 pm 
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That is not the way I understood it, but I'll look into it. I was under the impression filling and redrilling was all that was needed. Brad or Jeremy want to comment?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 12:35 am 
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Location: 315 N. Hwy 79 Panama City Beach, FL 32413 850-235-2281
disclaimer**
if your thinking bout buying a wave for pleasure use the EZ Loc rudder system, current production, is what you need. simple and works w/o and maintenance. The following is for those who are class racing only.
disclaimer**

EZ loc rudder must have the special EZ Loc blade. One might be able to fabricate a fiberglass blade to fit but I think it could be a wast of time. The plastic housing would still flex to much.

before anyone goes trying to put Aluminum castings on there EZ Loc pintles they are different. I've not tried to make one fit but they are not the same part. I would ASSUME they will be a simple swap to the old style pintles but I've not tried.

The old style aluminum casting will accept any boat blade except the h20 blade. The lower castings are the same as 17/18.

The old style rudder should be faster if the fiberglass blades are used. If you change the language to allow and style Hobie blade you would need to allow someone to change the new boats, I would think if the plastic blade only was used then the performance might now to much different.

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 Post subject: Re: Wave Racers
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 6:38 am 
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xanderwess wrote:
Any comments? I plan to submit this next week. Contact me xanderwess@yahoo.com


comments? Ya...LEAVE IT ALONE

Why alienate the newer boats? Now you've got a dealer confirming this perception that pre-EZ Lock blades/castings/boats are better, and you want to take it a step further and allow EPO's ?!? Widening this discrepency. :?

So you'll never be "competitive" unless you've got an older boat with the AL castings and glass boards...great. Going down the road of the Hobie 16, a wonderful way to introduce people to Hobie racing, encourage them to show up, and then proceed to tell them all the reasons their boat will never be as fast as the other guys.

Why can't there be a class of Hobie racing that you just show up with the damned boat and sail? :x

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:02 am 
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now don't get me wrong I think someone should be allowed to use the old castings if they want to. They allow for more rudder adjustment to accommodate the mast rake. There is nothing wrong with the aluminum casting they just aren't as user friendly for the weekend sailor as the EZ Loc.

Until just a few years ago the H16's came stock with plastic blades, there was a race upgrade if you wanted the fiberglass blades.

Yes I think they boats needs to be shipped with the EZ Loc rudder system and it is up to the person than wants to race if they want to spend the money to upgrade/downgrade to the other style.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:31 am 
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Jezz John, why don't you jump down my throat a bit. It SEEMS TO ME that there already is a difference between the old style and new style to begin with. Some of the 'already established' Wave racers have racing rudders on their boats, so THAT is why I am thinking on this and have asked for comments FROM WAVE SAILORS, so, unless you're getting Wave a :x anytime soon.....


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:58 am 
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Location: Storm Lake, IA
I dont have a wave and i dont intend on racing one soon so here is my opinion! I think sense the 14 16 20 ect. allow the epo's why exclude the wave? But what do I care?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:03 am 
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Location: Clear Lake Iowa
Andy: Wow. (you know the rest.....)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:39 pm 
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So you guys are saying there IS a performance advantage with the alternate rudders? It's not just durability?

I can tell you I'm not going to spend the money to swap out to the older style. I like my EZ-Locs!

But then again, I'm not a serious competitive racer, nor do I plan to become one.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:28 pm 
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I'm playing with the mill and EPO2 right now just to see if the modification is easily doable. I think it should work. I've always wondered anyway. Just a test, stand by...


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