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PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 7:45 pm 
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Hi, I have never used a kayak before for fishing. I have been researching different ones for roughly a year now. The Native Titan 10 looked nice but apparently can have rudder cable issues. I know it's not on the open market yet but would the 2019 Outback be good for a river as well as a lake? River fishing would be in winter, but not a large river with moderate rapids at worst. In lake conditions could the 2019 Outback handle moderate chop (low level white caps) without fear of capsizing or being unable to control the kayak? The general opinions I've read so far seem to be highly favorable of the new Outback so I'm looking for advice from experienced kayak anglers. Thank you.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 6:57 pm 
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Location: Missoula, Montana
I have 33 years of whitewater kayaking experience. I started kayak fishing from an 13' Ocean Kayak "Trident," which is a paddle kayak. After a couple of years of paddle kayak fishing, a friend got an Outback. I tried it, and was instantly sold on the advantages of a pedal kayak for fishing. I bought a 13' Revolution, and do almost all of my fishing from it. The only time I use my Trident is when I'm fishing in a shallow river. Because of the risk of damaging my Mirage Drive and my rudder, I only use my Revolution in rivers in which the water is reliably more than about three feet deep. If you use a Mirage Drive kayak in a shallow and/or rocky river, sooner or later you will damage or break your Mirage Drive and/or your rudder. And probably sooner, rather than later. That would be an expensive mistake.

So if you want to fish in shallow rocky rivers, I recommend that you get a sit-on-top paddle kayak for use on those rivers, and a pedal kayak for use in lakes, the ocean, and deep rivers. The 2019 Outback would be an excellent choice for a pedal fishing kayak. Or you could put the plug in the Mirage Drive hole on an Outback or other Hobie kayak and paddle it on shallow rocky rivers. When paddled, an Outback or a Revolution is less maneuverable than a whitewater kayak, but more maneuverable than a typical recreational sea kayak. The reason to put the plug in the Mirage Drive hole is to keep water from sloshing in and out of the cockpit through the hole, which is irritating. You can stick your heel in the Mirage Drive hole to reduce the amount of water which sloshes in and out of the hole, but the plug does a much better job of sealing the hole.

Kayak anglers routinely use Outbacks and Revolutions to fish in the open ocean, going in and out through surf when necessary. Those kayaks can handle a little chop and whitecaps with no problem at all. But don't head out on the water when high winds and big waves are present or threatened until you develop your kayaking skills and learn your comfort level with those conditions. As you push your boundaries, eventually will have a scary day out on the water, and will learn when the weather and wave conditions are sufficiently exciting that you should stay home. Remember the saying, "Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgment." Because of my whitewater kayaking background, when the wind and waves get particularly exciting, I pull up my Mirage Drive and paddle my kayak, so I can brace with my paddle as necessary.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 5:32 pm 
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Thank you, excellent advice. I am currently deciding between a PA or the outback 2019 but really have till next spring to decide. As far as the river there are definitely some shallow and rocky spots, particularly if the water level is low. I think a drift boat or other option may be better. My worry in lake fishing is flipping the kayak when conditions get a bit choppy. I had one experience some years back where a wind storm suddenly came up and I had to get my 10 foot boat towed back to shore on a lake. I would not like being stuck in that with any kayak. I love the freedom a kayak can offer you with easier transportation, less maintenance. I have also considered getting outriggers to increase the stability, I would imagine that would make something like a PA; which is already stable, pretty difficult to be flipped unless the conditions are extreme. I also need to keep in mind I need a platform that can handle small downriggers as I would primarily use the kayak for kokanee fishing. Thank you for the feedback.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:48 pm 
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Location: Missoula, Montana
Most of the kayak anglers who fish in the ocean in Hobie kayaks use Revolutions and Outbacks. You don't see many Pro Anglers in the ocean. So the Revolution and the Outback can definitely handle waves and weather. The Outback and the Revolution are way easier to transport and get to launch sites than the Pro Anglers. If you get a Pro Angler, you'll probably end up trailering it. And the Revolution and the Outback can handle downriggers. I do a lot of downrigger trolling for lake trout and kokanee from my Revolution. For a description of how I mounted a Cannon Lake-Troll downrigger on my Revolution, why I set up my kayak the way I did, and how to use a downrigger from a kayak, see my post at http://www.northwestkayakanglers.com/in ... #msg138905 . It looks like it would be easy to mount a downrigger on the 2019 Outback because you can use one of the gear track and H-Bar pairs in front of the seat to stabilize the base for a downrigger.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:07 am 
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Thank you for the feedback. The primary reason I was thinking of a pro angler is the extra width and higher sides. From the videos I have seen the outback sits so much lower in the water then the pro angler, maybe that's just my perception not having any experience. I think I could use a truck extender to transport without the need for a trailer. I'm sure hauling that extra weight to and from locations would get tiresome though. I was thinking along the same lines about a downrigger for the outback, I like the layout for the rail and tracks on the new outback.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:35 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
Quote:
You don't see many Pro Anglers in the ocean.


I think a lot are used in the Oceans.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:22 am 
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Im still working on a more detailed review, but since this may be applicable here I’ll share. I was out on “exciting” water with my 2017 Mirage Sport for hours this past Labor Day, exciting because of the power boat traffic Southern Indiana, Brookville Lake. Not a huge lake, couple thousand acres I think, 12x1.5 ish miles. But, so much traffic 2-3ft breaking white caps from 100-150ft along shorelines to short choppy water pretty much everywhere except the middle, which isn’t real comfortable either with boats even at a distance 360 around you. You just never know sometimes with some of these yahoos... or what they’re inhaling these days, so best to pay attention. Fly your flag, (I have a purse size air horn handy enough), and because I left before sunrise I just left my nav light on all day. I don’t know if a flag is a lightening rod, but that’s another several topics and a bit more than “exciting” water.

Having said that, I played around with it since I was there... learning the (new to me) Hobie Sport 9’7” yak, turns, leans, quartering, following swells, tried a few times to take water direct over the bow and succeeded happily, even submarined coming off one swell and into a breaker, ha! No real issues, it is just water one hopes.

First time out with the sailing rudder too (still have ST Fins - 180) I can’t tell a whole lot of difference with turns, it was already quick, but - this thing tracks now! I did snug, adjust and straighten the control lines when I installed it, and now I can cruise 3mph/ish and only occasionally need to correct, hands off! Substantial improvement! Overall fun experience, unnecessarily tiring after hours of sloshing around, but learned quite a few things. One, I don’t see myself using an anchor much, but a stake out pole is a must, for anything from taking a break to shoreline or site fishing there is no way to drift in confused seas except confusingly.

Not a good day for fishing much so used most of the day scouting and playing around and watching [out for] the half naked wakeboarders. I did have standing water and a Plano 3600 floating under the seat when I got back. Other than that, unless you forget your life vest (or don’t wear it), or have tangling lines everywhere and generally don’t know your boat or what you’re doing, you’d have to work at getting into any real trouble in an 80F fresh water lake. As with all things marine (human) there is no perfect boat so I generally don’t try to give perfect advice.

I would (will) have no issues using the Mirage Drive plug and raising the flip & stow rudder for shallow river runs, but I won’t be paddling back up stream much. A float plan with a pick up point, I will have no problem with at all.

After several hours and several “experiments”, a couple dry bags were barely moist on the outer surface but there was no water inside the hull so the front hatch must be working pretty well. I have heard the front hatch could be sealed better on some models, but likely not a big fix or big problem.


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