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 Post subject: STAR sails
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:28 pm 
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Hi all. I have been sailing my Revo 13 with the Hobie factory sail for three summers. I'm thinking of getting a Star sail for Christmas: the standard 2.5 m (as opposed to the Hobie 1.7). I'm usually sailing in 10mph winds.

Is anyone using the Star and how do you like it? I'm an experienced sailor.


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:35 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 9:40 pm
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I have 2 star sails, the 3.4m2 and a small storm sail that clips to the furled large one as i live in an area when 20+ knot winds spring up out of nowhere.

The star sail is amazing . A lot more flexible mast than the hobie and a far better furling system combine to have my hobie sail languishing in the shed. Basically the star washes off excess wind by flexing and spilling it - its nearly twice the size of the hobie sail and gives me a chance of keeping up with the Ais on a low wind day.

Then if the wind gets really gnarly i just furl and clip on a small storm sail thats around the 1.2m2 mark - its a completely different design with a really low centre of effort that stops my amas from burying and converts more of the sideways wind into forward thrust when its howling. Its got a boom so with a following wind it doesnt taco shell.

Cant recommend them enough - and for the yanks out there star now has an american guy licenced to produce them so you can get it without getting raped on postage etc.

Im using them on a revo13 2015 modded with finns amas to be a mini ai


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:45 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:17 pm
Posts: 679
Location: Auckland NZ
I am intrigued by the reply to the original question!

Basically I have gone in completely the opposite direction to the old master (Altmeister) and it is difficult for me to glean much input that relates to my set-up from his reply.

I sail without amas on an AI hull with an adaptor to accept the small hobie mast. I have upgraded my mast to a carbon fibre one so that it is stiffer and doesn't deform anything like as much in stronger winds. With this kit I will never keep up with an AI (except in the lightest of breezes when nobody is going anywhere fast) because you simply can't load up the sail like you can on a trimaran without risking a capsize. I can fly a 1.8m2 jib to increase sail area in light winds but I rarely do that these days (for simplicity's sake). I use a boom batten to reduce bellying/collapsing and resultant rolling on a dead downwind course.

I would be very interested to know how the Star sail is likely to compare with the standard Hobie sail on my set-up. Clearly a larger sail will work better in lighter winds but if the Star and Hobie were the same size would there be any noticeable advantage/difference in performance of one over the other - in other words is the star sail intrinsically a better-designed, cut, constructed, cloth sail or just a sail with more area, a different shape (and a boom?)...?


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:03 am 
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Posts: 26
stobbo wrote:
I am intrigued by the reply to the original question!

Basically I have gone in completely the opposite direction to the old master (Altmeister) and it is difficult for me to glean much input that relates to my set-up from his reply.

I sail without amas on an AI hull with an adaptor to accept the small hobie mast. I have upgraded my mast to a carbon fibre one so that it is stiffer and doesn't deform anything like as much in stronger winds. With this kit I will never keep up with an AI (except in the lightest of breezes when nobody is going anywhere fast) because you simply can't load up the sail like you can on a trimaran without risking a capsize. I can fly a 1.8m2 jib to increase sail area in light winds but I rarely do that these days (for simplicity's sake). I use a boom batten to reduce bellying/collapsing and resultant rolling on a dead downwind course.

I would be very interested to know how the Star sail is likely to compare with the standard Hobie sail on my set-up. Clearly a larger sail will work better in lighter winds but if the Star and Hobie were the same size would there be any noticeable advantage/difference in performance of one over the other - in other words is the star sail intrinsically a better-designed, cut, constructed, cloth sail or just a sail with more area, a different shape (and a boom?)...?


Ok - the 3.4 doesnt have a boom - only the storm sail does.


The 3.4 obviously gets more wind on low wind days - yet is less tippy on high wind days due to the mast flexing.

I dont understand why you would stiffen your mast as wind strong enough to put you in the drink will do that better with a stiff mast.

Its hard to say - esp taking into account your hull speed is a bit faster than mine


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:30 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:12 pm
Posts: 8
I sail 99% of my considerable time out...open ocean, or wide bay areas in FNQ. using Revo11.
Have the meduim Star, and the small one. Both good sails, flex mast works well, though as I am 55ks wringing wet I use the small sail most.

Furls v.well, easy (no maintenance) occassional rinse with fresh water, had for 3 yrs, sailing average 3 times per week still looks good and no damage, lives in 20cm piping attached to roof racks, so gets v hot up here. So good value all round.

Might add yak lives on roof rack too, gets its wash when the car does, only comes off to sail , or it,s monthly check out, no bends lumps or bumps, very hardy craft our Hobies...

PK
T,ville


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:47 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Cedar Key, FL
I'm considering getting a set of Star sails for my Outback.

Ideally, I'd like to get a combo of a 2.5m2 and 1.7m2, but they only seem to sell the combo with the 3 or 3.3 m2 models.

Has anyone used one of the larger sails on an Outback without amas?

I think the standard Hobie sale is about 1.9m2, correct?

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:48 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
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Location: Cedar Key, FL
I just spent a weekend on the water with Star Giant (3 m2) sail.

Some thoughts.

The rep in the US was very good to work with. I ordered the Giant/Gale Tamer combo. After I ordered the sails, I emailed him to let him know that I planned to be on the water this weekend and he quickly responded that he'd expedite the manufacture/shipping to get the sails to me on time (which he did). I told him that I planned to use the small Gale Tamer on a Hobie Sport that my in-laws have and he helpfully gave me dimensions to build my own aluminum mast so we could sail both boats at the same time.

Assembly was very easy. The kit only requires pop riveting the mast together and tying on the main sheet as the fuler came completely assembled (the online instructions imply that assembly of the furler would be needed). My Outback was already rigged for sailing with a block on the rear and a cleat on the right side. I tested the sail before installing the block and cleat for the furler which took five minutes with a drill and screw driver.

The sails are designed to have a pvc pipe "sheath" over the mast. The pvc sheath is snug in the sail pocket, but spins very easily around the mast. The result is a very easy furling/unfurling action.

I saw a variety of weather this weekend from very choppy with 10 mph winds gusting to 17 to very calm with light breezes (4 to 7 mph). In higher winds, the flexible mast performed well and dumped wind when needed and I never felt any more tippy that I would have on the standard Hobie sail. As you'd expect, the sail really shines in light breezes.

I'm still getting accustomed to the extra flex in the mast. After so many years on the standard Hobie sail, I could "feel" the proper position of the sail through the sheet. With the flexible mast, I needed to pay more attention after each tack or change in wind. The size of the sail also creates some challenges when sailing close to the wind with some creases when properly set (especially in light breezes). One modification that I might make is to rig something to change the angle of the sheet between the rear block and the sail (I'm sure there's a proper sailing term for that, but I don't know it). The current angle puts too much downward force on the end of this large sail which causes unneeded mast flexing and sail creases.

The little GT sail was perfect on the Sport. It was my MinL's first time ever "sailing". Other than complaining that she had to pedal to keep up with me and getting impatient beating into the wind she had a blast. The homemade mast worked fine, but after looking at the Star mast (the lower section has two smaller aluminum tubes in the base), I might need to reinforce the lower section more. If the mast receiver is 10 inches deep, how high up should the mast be reinforced? 12 inches? 14 inches?

Bottom line is that I'm happy with the purchase so far.

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:00 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Cedar Key, FL
Following up on my own post ...

Apparently I'm not the only one who has noticed the angle of the mainsheet to the Giant sail is not ideal. From the Star Sail website:

Image

Anyone know what that device on the rear of the kayak is called?

It appears to just be a pvc frame mounted in scupper holes held down by some shock cord, but that would seem likely to pull out on a broad reach.

Anyone have experience with this?

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2014 4:00 pm
Posts: 492
Pollo de muerte wrote:
Anyone know what that device on the rear of the kayak is called?

Google images of YAWL BOOMKIN for ideas along the same principle:

Image Image

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Last edited by daft on Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:33 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:17 pm
Posts: 679
Location: Auckland NZ
Actually a 'horse' I think... ?!


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 1:15 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:08 pm
Posts: 2
Hi. Reporting back on my original query re the Star sails.

I got my Star (the 2.5) and sailed with it last summer and really enjoy it. It performs much better on a close reach than the Hobie standard sail, and the furling action is much smoother, except for when the furling line creeps below the PVC tube which I have to keep a close eye on.

Upsides:
Better speed
Better pointing
Only use my Hobie sail now in heavier winds

Downsides:
1. It's tippier than the Hobie sail. I'm actually putting on a pair of AMAs this summer, so I can push the limits more. I flipped 2x last summer getting used to the sail, and that's too much with fishing gear. I'd also like to use the larger sail on lighter wind days, but want more guarantee of stability.
2. I have problems with the furling line getting caught under the PVC tube
3. It's not as pretty as the Hobie sail


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:59 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Cedar Key, FL
npwebster wrote:
2. I have problems with the furling line getting caught under the PVC tube


Where did you put the block for the furling line?

I installed the block as shown in this video just after the 2:00 mark:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... uqBfuLUiRQ

It works like a charm for me.

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2018 1:14 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Cedar Key, FL
I've been tinkering with the Star sail for a few months now.

My only issue has been that the mast bends too much when lying close to the wind causing the sail shape to deform.

Before increasing the stiffness of the mast (which would put more stress on the mast receiver and raise the odds of capsizing), I decided to tackle the rather extreme angle of the mainsheet to the rear block (see my 2/19 post).

"There, I fixed it" photos to follow:

Image

Image

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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 7:32 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 6:46 pm
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I just bought a used revo 16 that came with a Star sail. Is there an easy measurement to determine if the sail is a standard or giant? Is the mast length an easy difference?


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 Post subject: Re: STAR sails
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 3:06 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:55 pm
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Location: Cedar Key, FL
davesp wrote:
I just bought a used revo 16 that came with a Star sail. Is there an easy measurement to determine if the sail is a standard or giant? Is the mast length an easy difference?


I emailed the US distributor and asked for dimensions.

You might be able to figure out whether out you have a Standard, Giant or Supernova by the location and size of the smaller batten. Take a look at the pics here: https://www.yaksailing.com/high-performance-kayak-sails

I'll report back on the dimensions.

Really interested in how the Revo 16 handles the larger sail. I've been sailing Outbacks since 2004 and I'm very comfortable in that slow (stable) tub, but I was tempted to try a Revo when I replaced my original Outback last December.

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