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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:32 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:16 pm
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Location: Colorado
Yep.. I always have the peddles in the socket and also often use them.

About a week ago, two of us with TI's were talking to a third person with sailing experience who was thinking about getting a TI. Question was how do you tack the TI. My TI buddy doesnt like to use the pedals too much and explained to bear off a little to pick up speed, start the turn, ease the sail.. etc.

New person asked me.. Just pedal through it, the pedals are why I bought this boat in the first place.

Interesting the different ways this boat gets used. My wife would also never go with me if she could not pedal.

Im not sure having the pedals in place would explain the speed difference as the drag from the pedals should be about the same front to back. However, if the speed we did the test at was much different, that would be a big variable


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:54 am 
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stringy, glad to see you have a fire extinguisher on board. I see plenty of kayakers with gas motors and no extinguisher.


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:33 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Probably why you dont see fire extinguisher on boats like a TI with an outboard at least in the US

Up to 26': One B-I size extinguisher. Fire extinguishers are not required on outboard-powered pleasure boats less than 26' in length, not carrying passengers for hire, without permanently-installed fuel tanks, that do not have spaces where explosive or flammable gasses or vapors can collect.

This is a good reason to NOT store any external gas tanks inside the hull.

One source for that among many.. https://www.westmarine.com/WestAdvisor/ ... inguishers


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:18 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:25 pm
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
jacksonbigtuna wrote:
stringy, glad to see you have a fire extinguisher on board. I see plenty of kayakers with gas motors and no extinguisher.

I’m guessing you're referring to that red bottle behind the rear passenger JBT?
It’s not a clear pic (still from a video), but if I tried to put out a fire with that it would have the opposite effect ...its a 1L fuel bottle! (cue David Bowie song)
Back on P10 of this thread we discussed safety requirements and according to our regs an extinguisher is only required if you have an electric start, electric motor, gas/fuel stove -not for a petrol outboard. Sounds strange I know, but technically anyone with a Torqeedo should have an extinguisher!

I agree with Walt. On the Islands, as long as fuel is carried externally (never inside the hull) the risk of a fire is very low.

Still, carrying an extinguisher is a good idea, but a bit problematic given the harsh conditions we get on our Islands. I have thought about it but have yet to get one. I was looking at a small 500g aerosol DCP available at Bunnings. It could be kept in a dry bag stored behind the front seat, which is suggested by Tony back on P10.


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:13 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:58 am
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Location: Forster, NSW, Australia
I keep my extinguisher in a drybag

_________________
Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:48 am 
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This extinguisher fits nicely into one of the TI bottleholders. It's not a full-sized extinguisher but it gets the job done. Much better than nothing, and for an extinguisher to be effective it must be readily accessible. Your best hope to put out a fire is immediately after it starts. If you have to fumble around to retrieve it, the fire can rapidly go out of control, especially if it's a gasoline fire. You need to get your hands on an extinguisher as soon as possible after the fire starts.


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:29 pm 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Yes, that’s a good point Pro10is -it must be easy to get to.
However you want it to work properly when needed, so protecting it from the elements is also important, especially the salt water torrents that we cop on our Islands at times.

In the link you provided above are some interesting test videos of the different extinguishers.
A Dry Chemical Powder extinguisher is the most versatile and will extinguish most fires however their effectiveness is wind related. The powder has to get to the seat of the fire which can be difficult to do in strong winds.

In reality, copious quantities of water will extinguish most fires, so a bucket is probably all that’s needed on Islands. The bailer that should be carried as part of our safety equipment can double up as an extinguisher ...so keep it handy!


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:33 am 
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stringy wrote:
Yes, that’s a good point Pro10is -it must be easy to get to.
However you want it to work properly when needed, so protecting it from the elements is also important, especially the salt water torrents that we cop on our Islands at times.

In the link you provided above are some interesting test videos of the different extinguishers.
A Dry Chemical Powder extinguisher is the most versatile and will extinguish most fires however their effectiveness is wind related. The powder has to get to the seat of the fire which can be difficult to do in strong winds.

In reality, copious quantities of water will extinguish most fires, so a bucket is probably all that’s needed on Islands. The bailer that should be carried as part of our safety equipment can double up as an extinguisher ...so keep it handy!

A fire caused by gasoline, which is probably the most likely thing on a TI to cause a fire, is classified as a Class B fire. Water is not recommended for Class B fires because it can disperse the gasoline and thus spread the fire.

The fire extinguisher I referenced is suitable for Class B fires and is very resistant to salt water exposure as it has few working parts and they are not exposed. I would recommend using this as a first response because it's easy to store on a TI in a way where you could reach it very quickly. But I would also recommend having a real fire extinguisher stowed onboard in a safe location also in case this did not put out the fire completely.


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:45 am 
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Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
With small amounts of fuel, water will extinguish a flammable fuel fire without spreading it.
BTW- I couldn’t find where it stated the Tundra is suitable for Class B flammable liquids. It only mentions grease in the specs. It does say not to store in areas exposed to heat. Could be a problem in direct sunlight. I’d like to know what’s in it, as it’s not allowed to be sold in California.


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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:48 am 
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stringy wrote:
With small amounts of fuel, water will extinguish a flammable fuel fire without spreading it.
BTW- I couldn’t find where it stated the Tundra is suitable for Class B flammable liquids. It only mentions grease in the specs. It does say not to store in areas exposed to heat. Could be a problem in direct sunlight. I’d like to know what’s in it, as it’s not allowed to be sold in California.

I'm not a fireman, nor an expert on extinguishing fires, but the experts do specifically say not to use water on a Class B (gasoline) fire.

Here is one rated for Class B fires. Here is another. As you can see they get very favorable reviews. These use expandable foam to smother fires. It's highly doubtful sunlight alone will cause any issues with them. I've had mine onboard in full sunlight at 90+ degrees since 2015. They're only rated for 3 years use so at the end of last season, after buying a replacement, I decided to try the old one out on a gasoline fire I made on my gravel driveway. It extinguished it in seconds.

These are, of course, certainly not the best fire extinguishers available, but for an easily storable, easily reachable, first response Class B suitable extinguisher for the TI, this is probably the best bet. Certainly better than water or a bulky extinguisher stored inside the hull which would be difficult to retrieve in time, and most certainly better than nothing.


Last edited by pro10is on Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TI outboard mount
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:51 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:16 pm
Posts: 599
Location: Colorado
I did a quick search on outboard fires and it seemed every thing I could find involved the electrical system.

My Suzuki 2.5 has a very minimal electrical system and even then its extremely low power/ energy.

Im going to keep the fuel storage above deck in a container intended for gas as is legally required. The fire extinguisher is going on the list that also includes one of those at sea hurricane survivable life rafts.

My cupped hand to fling water on the outboard will have to do for now..

Now if someone can find a case where one of these 2 or 2.5 hp outboards that dont even have battery charging capability actually did catch on fire.. I will change my priorities.


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