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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2016 8:35 am 
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Chekika wrote:
Because of this thread length, I have made a Table of Contents. This Table is on P. 22, http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=7276&start=315


stringy wrote:
Mick,
Keith is correct and if your son needs something more definitive then he should read Hobie's Guru Roadrunner's original trampoline test found here on Page 3 viewtopic.php?f=69&t=12342. The pics are gone but the test details remain. Basically he rammed a buoy with the tramps on but with the aka brace disconnected. The tramps alone held everything out and in place.
Just one proviso - FE Bob has reported a hard enough collision may break the tramp buckles so keep out lines may be a sensible back up. I've never broken a brace pin with the tramps fitted, but have broken 3 sailing without tramps. I'm guessing the fitted tramps must take some pressure off the pin?

Yes, Stringy, I suspect that the tramps effectively reduce aka-brace pin breakage. Same with hakas, but the danger with hakas (of which I am a great fan) is that they can make the akas a rigid system (the brace pin will not break) leading to other damage to the boat. I have capsized, but the only damage i have ever done to my boats is an occasional aka-brace pin or rudder pin break (1 brace pin, 2 rudder pins) in more than 8 yrs sailing Islands.

Keith

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"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


Last edited by Chekika on Thu Dec 22, 2016 3:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:41 pm 
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stringy wrote:
Just one proviso - FE Bob has reported a hard enough collision may break the tramp buckles so keep out lines may be a sensible back up. I've never broken a brace pin with the tramps fitted, but have broken 3 sailing without tramps. I'm guessing the fitted tramps must take some pressure off the pin?
I get the impression that, at some point, Hobie was using 1" buckles on the tramps.

I used 1.5" on my tramp; but, before making it, I dummied up something using 1" buckles and it was immediately obvious to me that 1" were hopless.

So... If my impression about Hobie using the 1" buckles at some point is correct that might be the genisis of the Tramp-Fails-When-Pin-Fails stories.

Mine uses 5 of the 1.5" buckles. ..... I have tried to break it with my 220# of lard, but have not succeeded. .. I suppose if I tried hard enough - like point loading it with my feet and concentrating the stress on 1 or 2 buckles I might be more successful... but with normal use, no way Jose'.

The folding force on the akas under sail in high-teens wind is surprisingly low. ..... The joker in the deck would be hitting something like a channel marker at speed.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:51 am 
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The Treasure of Pavilion Key


There is “The Treasure of the Sierra Madre,” which is well publicized by a movie of that name. Now there is The Treasure of Pavilion Key. Here is the story according to a note I received from Bob Smith last April. The subject of Bob’s email was “Weird event on Pavilion Key.”

Hi Keith,

As I was packing to return from Pavilion Key very early this morning - I really had to get back - there was a flash in the sky and I heard a voice. I caught the flash on film and the voice sounded very odd.

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"Aye, Matey, if you see that dead tree,
There's sure to be Treasure
around by its feet

Caribbean Cask, Balvenie's Work

There for those souls
To tell tall tales indiscreet

Of the Everglades Chalenge 2016

and tales of the seas

Sup hearty ye mateys where ever you meet"

I was gob smacked, wondering if I had a bit too much fun last night or if this really happened. I had to investigate a bit..I've circled the dead tree.

I approached the tree…

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and as I got closer I noticed that there was a prickly pear and something else…

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I decided to take a GPS reading when I was right on top of it...

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I started nosing around and saw that two shells had been placed near the tree, hmmm. I went back to my boat for my shovel and started to dig.

I hit something after poking around with a stick and some careful excavation...

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and found this

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Well, it was getting late, and I really had to get back home. I covered everything up as I found it, the Treasure is still waiting for sea-faring friends and some tall tale telling...

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Weird huh? Wouldn't have believed it if it didn't happen to me....



It just so happened that we had a trip planned for Pavilion 9 days later. So, of course, the treasure hunt was on. It was easy enough to find the dead tree and the prickly pear, the 2 shells were nowhere in sight. And the soil, which we thought would show signs of recent excavation by Bob, was quite hard packed. No indication of any excavation at all. At least 2 groups tried to find the treasure, without luck. Josh Morgan was not deterred. He went to work poking around in the sandy loam. He took the task quite seriously and, using a small shovel available, poked vigorously in the soil. Clang! Paydirt!! Another poke, another clang.

Josh retrieving the treasure as Royd Whedon stands over him and Toby Nipper looks on.

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Josh pulls the treasure out of protective holder. It definitely has Toby's interest.

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Treasure hunter, Josh Morgan, and his find

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The treasure: A bottle of Scotch and container. The container shows a couple good whacks which Josh administered in his enthusiastic search. The treasure was not a chest of gold coins, but no body complained.

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The motley crew of treasure hunters. Left to right: Charley Fast, Alicia Whedon, Josh, Don Haynes, Joe Slama, Jimmy Stewart, Royd, Henry Ovares.

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Royd & Rick Parks enjoying a good cigar.

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First night everyone is on their own for dinner. Afterwards, the group is enjoying a laugh and a taste of Scotch. The bottle is being passed around in the group.

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Don got this sunset picture the first night.

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People came and went during this trip. Josh rarely stays more than overnight. Here he is outbound in his Epic V7 surfski.

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The MacPhails arrived in a heavy downpour on Day 2. We are sheltered from the downpour and having fun. Rick, Debbie Turner, myself, Roy and Ardelia MacPhail. Don Haynes, in the rain, got this picture.

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Dinner on Day 2 was a big blowout, as we managed to get a break in the rains about dinner time. Debbie and myself fried the fish. People put together their own fish tacos. Everyone contributed ingredients: soft tortillas, grated cheese, lettuce, chopped tomatoes, salsa, etc, etc. Dianne Haynes brought her “potato salad to die for.” Don Haynes brought his deviled crab balls—a meal in themselves. Everybody was so busy, we didn’t get a picture of people enjoying it all, but, if you weren’t there, you missed a feast. Don got this after dinner photo of 12 people relaxing and enjoying the ambiance.

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Earlier in the day, Debbie, I, and Rick cleaned fish. Cleaning fish is always a group endeavor. Don was the champ fisherman bringing in 3 of our 5 fish.

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The MacPhails preparing to leave. They were clearly the fashion statement in this group. Jimmy Stewart looks on.

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Soon after the MacPhails left, Tom Lachner arrived. He was very appreciative that we had saved some treasure for him. Alison looks on as Tom savors the scotch.

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Prickly pear cactus found throughout coastal Everglades—blossom lasts only one day.

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Several in our group returned to the mainland on Sunday, the 3rd day. Charlie & Henry ready to launch.

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Toby Nipper about to leave under paddle-power only.

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Toby paddling seems to be holding his own w/ Charlie & Henry. They are about a mile out with Crate Key in front of them.

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Those of us who stayed behind, enjoyed another great group meal. These people know how to relax at the end of the day. Jimmy is in the foreground, then Rick, Debbie, me (cleaning a wind protector), Dianne Haynes (far back), Royd, and Alison. Again, we have to thank Don, our resident photographer, for this shot.

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While we didn’t fish today, we did trek down the beach about a mile to haul back some fire wood. Tom fired it up and took this picture.

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All good things must come to pass. Alison and Royd ready to cast off on Monday morning. Royd is always the first one out.

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Not everyone is anxious to leave. Rick and Debbie enjoying breakfast.

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Sooner rather than later, we all had to leave, since tides wait for no man (or woman). Debbie packing up.

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Another good outing with the best of friends. Special thanks to Bob Smith for providing the Treasure and enough directions to track it down.

Keith

_________________
2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


Last edited by Chekika on Thu Oct 26, 2017 5:09 am, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 2:30 pm 
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Great story Keith! 8)
After reading of the flash and voice in the sky, I was convinced that bottle was buried empty. :wink:

PeteCress wrote:
I used 1.5" on my tramp; but, before making it, I dummied up something using 1" buckles and it was immediately obvious to me that 1" were hopless.
So... If my impression about Hobie using the 1" buckles at some point is correct that might be the genisis of the Tramp-Fails-When-Pin-Fails stories.

That is correct Pete, however the tramps I have owned (AI and TI) have only ever had the 1" buckles. As I have never broken a buckle, I wouldn't consider them hopeless but going to a stronger buckle was a sensible Hobie upgrade.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 6:07 pm 
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Keith thanks for the stories and recent Haka Pics.
I'm finishing the last tweaks to my TI before NCC. No new changes between now and then. (hoping to the do the EC 2017).
Once I'm back, I want to build the table/Haka bench and the storage cover over the front seat area similar Mr Mako.

As far as the tramps keeping the Aka out in the event of a pin failure. My experience is that I was in the front seat when the crossbar support popped free. This is a similar situation as a broken pin. In this video at 8 seconds you can see the the support pop free. This was caused by a knot that I had in the furling and main sheet line getting wedged between the hull and the release knob. Either way, I was on cold flat water in high winds. Furled about half way. I continued on through several tacks and another mile or two before I even knew that it was detached. Based on this I trust the tramps to keep the ama out on flat water. Open or rough water is a different animal and I'll use keepout lines.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7eEePC74vQ


As a side note, its looking like my wife and I will be on Ft. Myers in mid Nov with the TI for a week.

Paul Links
Aero70


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 7:42 pm 
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What a great trip, and report

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 9:16 pm 
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Glad you enjoyed the story, Stringy & Tony. It was a fun trip to be sure.

Aero, after years of avoiding it, I'm planning to do the 2017 EC. Most of the people in the above story are WaterTribers and have either completed the EC or at least attempted it. Rick Parks. Debbie Turner, and myself have a number of practice trips planned leading up to the EC2017. The first trip will be on Nov 11-12. We will leave from Ft Desoto and travel to Checkpoint #1 (Cape Haze). Our purpose during these practice trips is simply to check out the shoreline and places we might camp, if necessary. You are invited to join us if it fits your schedule. We will camp at Ft Desoto on Nov 10.

Keith

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"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 11:09 am 
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Keith,
Its looking like that weekend will work. We are just working getting work weekends sorted out.
If you get another thread of group chat going for that trip please include me.

Thanks
Paul Links


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 3:07 pm 
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Paul, send me an email. I usually set up a group email about a trip. With your email you will be added to the group. My email is kwellma at gmail dot com

Keith

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"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:30 am 
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Preparation for the WaterTribe 2017 Everglades Challenge

Several of us (Rick Parks, Debbie Turner, and myself) are planning some training/reconnoitering trips in our preparation for the WaterTribe 2017 Everglades Challenge. If you are interested in doing any of these trips, please post here or contact me, 305-979-3362. Of course, you can post any questions or comments here. These trips will cover the general route from Ft Desoto Park East Beach (the start of the Everglades Challenge) to the finish in Key Largo in the Florida Keys, a distance of about 280 miles. We will likely have other trips of a more casual and “fun” nature during this year’s camping season.

2016-2017 Planned Trips

Completed. Nov 11-12, Ft Desoto to Cape Haze, 65 miles. Camp at Ft Desoto Park Campground, site #5, on both Nov 10 and Nov 13. Rick Parks, Debbie Turner, Paul Links, and I did this trip.

Dec 1-3, Eldred's Marina in Placida (a few miles south of CKP 1) to Everglades City, 110 mi

Jan 5, FLM to Bay Cove (Pelican Resort), 35 miles. Debbie & Rick will come to Pinecrest, FL, on Jan 3, stay overnight, load boats, go to FLM on Jan 4, camp overnight, sail FLM to Bay Cove on Jan 5.

Jan 29-Feb 4, Chok to FLM, 70 miles. Enjoy fish fry’s and "easy" days. This is our annual leisure, fun-filled trip. (Last year we caught no fish despite our best efforts. Well, actually, the trip was a challenge from start to finish. We did essentially NO fishing.)

Mar 4-11, WaterTribe Everglades Challenge, 280 miles

Keith
305-979-3362

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


Last edited by Chekika on Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:03 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 11:46 am 
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Chekika wrote:
Josh.....outbound in his Epic V7 surfski.

Image
Did Josh offer up a rationale for his use of an Aleut insteas of a wing paddle with the surfski?

_________________
2015 AI in "Dune" - "The Grey Pig"
2017 Trailex 450 Trailer
Pre-September 2015 cradles
(anybody want to buy a slightly-used AI SpinKit?)
eMail: Confirm@FatBelly.com


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 12:34 pm 
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PeteCress wrote:
Chekika wrote:
Josh.....outbound in his Epic V7 surfski.

Image
Did Josh offer up a rationale for his use of an Aleut instead of a wing paddle with the surfski?

No, Pete, I didn't ask him any more than I didn't ask him why he paddled out 10 miles on a paddle board once. As you probably know, Aleut paddles are much easier on joints than wing paddles. We never know what Josh might be sailing or paddling the next time we see him. Great kid.

Keith

_________________
2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


Last edited by Chekika on Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 2:31 pm 
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Chekika wrote:
As you probably know, Aleut paddles are much easier on joints than wing paddles.
No... I had no idea. ..... What joint problems I have had (elbows) have been from using arms/elbows to paddle instead of just as links to torso twist.

I understand it is possible to damage a shoulder with incorrect rolling technique - but most of the reason I went from sit-in kayaks to surf skis was no need for spray skirts, swamp recovery, or rolling.

10 miles is a pretty good paddle. ..... Most of my workouts come out to about 6. ..... Both ways (20 miles) is probably more than I could handle in non-survival mode. ..... I suspect Josh is in some seriously-good shape.

_________________
2015 AI in "Dune" - "The Grey Pig"
2017 Trailex 450 Trailer
Pre-September 2015 cradles
(anybody want to buy a slightly-used AI SpinKit?)
eMail: Confirm@FatBelly.com


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 5:10 pm 
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Josh is a fireman by profession, and he is in serious good shape.

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 5:46 am 
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1st Training Trip for EC2017

We are headed to Ft Desoto today (Nov 10), camping at Site 5 tonight. Tomorrow morning about 7 AM, we will begin our 2 day, 60+ mi trip down to Cape Haze. Friday night (Nov 11), we will be camping at South Lido County Park off Sarasota. Saturday night (Nov 12), we will camp at Cape Haze Marina if possible. Sunday (Nov 13) we will be camping back at Site 5 in Ft Desoto. Doing this trip will be Debbie Turner, Rick Parks, Paul Links, and myself. Charlie Fast is our land support. Jim Quinlan is joining us tomorrow morning for a day sail. Roy and Ardelia McPhail will be joining us Fri evening at South Lido County Park to finish the trip.

If you see us along the way, wave!

Keith

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