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PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:49 am 
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place marker, i’m following


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 6:36 pm 
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I have a Torqeedo 403 which I acquired as part of my boat when I bought it, the previous owner had installed it. It's a 2018 so about 3 years old now, I've had it for a year.

Unfortunately, the old owner when he installed it, installed cleats into the rear crossbar but did not realise to stop the screws just after they enter the black crossbar tube, and not go too deep. As a result, drilling them too far in meant that the port aka bar could not be ejected and it was stuck in place by these screws put in too deep.

I tried to rectify this as I wanted the ability to rooftop or run the TI in kayak-only mode. Unfortunately taking those screws out (which I assume were stainless steel, so believe they corroded a bit), one snapped and caused me a great deal of angst rectifying it. I have now had to drill it out, resulting in a larger hole in the crossbar, and now need to re-mount the harken cleats to raise/lower the torqeedo, either in the same spot or different.

1. Is there a better type of screw to use for the harken clamps in the crossbar, other than stainless steel, to avoid future corrosion and it jamming if it ever needs to be removed again in the future?

2. Where would the best spot to mount the two cleats be in this situation?

I can either drill 2 more 4mm holes in the crossbar and move them further down away from the big hole where I had to drill out the broken screw, towards the centre of the boat more, so both cleats can stay on the crossbar. But I'm a bit uncertain if this will add further weakness to the crossbar...however, the front crossbar does seem to have a lot of alternative holes in it for where to mount the main sheet cleat and doesn't appear to affect its strength, so maybe it will be OK given the small holes.

Alternatively, I can keep the UP line in the two good holes of the crossbar, and relocate the down clamp to screw straight into the gunwale. But that will mean drilling holes in the hull.

Some photos below, hopefully this serves as a reminder to others, when you do install the cleats, don't drill and screw it in too far so that it obstructs the aka bar insert!

Image

Image

Image

Image


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 4:23 am 
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First of all, the original owner did not follow my instructions on how to mount the cleats. He used the wrong parts and went off on his own. Hobie already had this fully and properly engineered, all he had to do was simply to use the exact same parts as Hobie used on the starboard side which are readily available. If he had used these parts as I described, the screws would have been the perfect size to hold the cleats in place and not adversely affect the operation of the aka bars.

I caution anyone doing this not to try to use different parts. Use the exact same parts as Hobie did. They're all available, including the screws, from Hobie dealers either locally or online such as Austin Kayak. Using the OEM parts will assure a proper fit. West Marine also stocks many of the OEM Harken parts in their stores and online.

To fix this mess, I recommend getting the correct parts and starting over. Simply move the cleats over a bit to redrill and re-tap the screw mounting holes. That's the only repair I can suggest that I know will work correctly, everything else is a risk. You are experiencing the results of having someone else doing it wrong.

Here is exactly how it should look:
Image

To anyone else attempting this, stick with Hobie's engineering. Unless you are an expert retrofitter, do not attempt to re-engineer this on your own. There is little to no room for error.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 4:59 am 
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Very good advice pro10is, after the grief of dealing with correcting this I completely agree. Looking at the main sheet cleat it is indeed engineered perfectly to suit the crossbar, screw depth and all. I shall try and obtain the replacement genuine parts to avoid further dramas !


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:08 am 
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Location: Gulf Shores, Alabama
So I've been trying to research this 1103 AC Motor to replace my old Evolve motor that has wire which completely disintegrated. While looking around the Torqeedo website, I noticed that there were recalls for Torqeedo batteries. Not sure if anyone on this Hobie forum has said anything about the recall. Turns out both of my batteries are on the list. Here's what the safety recall said
Quote:
"Torqeedo has found some examples in which the battery housings for those motors were not water tight. In such a case, water may penetrate the battery housing. This is a particular if a battery with a water permeable housing becomes completely or partially submerged under water. If water reaches the internal part of the battery it could cause a chemical reaction resulting in fire and/or bursting of the battery housing. Such a circumstance presents a risk of serious injury!"
Here's the link on torqeedo's site : https://www.torqeedo.com/us/en-us/servi ... afety.html

It appears my evolve motor uses what they classify the battery as "travel" I also own one of the spare ultralight 2 batteries which my serial# is also on the list. Just a heads up to check your batteries. They have pictures of the different types of batteries they have.

And back to the latest news of will a 1103AC fit on a TI. I asked that question of Austin Kayak and waiting to see what they may know. And Torqeedo still hasn't responded to my last correspondence unfortunately.

Jim


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:38 am 
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There are a couple threads on the Torqeedo battery recall. As a bonus, Torqeedo also offer a pro-rated upgrade of the 320 wh battery to the larger 915 wh battery which I opted for. But check their trade-in price against retailers like Defender Marine. Depending on your battery age, Defender’s discounted price may be better than what Torqeedo is offering.

Peter


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:50 am 
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Location: Gulf Shores, Alabama
plfinch wrote:
There are a couple threads on the Torqeedo battery recall. As a bonus, Torqeedo also offer a pro-rated upgrade of the 320 wh battery to the larger 915 wh battery which I opted for. But check their trade-in price against retailers like Defender Marine. Depending on your battery age, Defender’s discounted price may be better than what Torqeedo is offering.Peter

Thanks Peter. I'll check it out.
Jim


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:20 am 
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The Torqeedo battery recall happened last year. They will check the battery's relief valve to see if it's functioning correctly. They pay shipping both ways.

As mentioned above, they will also offer you upgrade pricing on a 915 Wh battery. I wish I had taken that because my 530 Wh battery died soon after it was returned.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2021 4:52 am 
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pro10is wrote:
Now that the boating season is finally underway where I live, I've asked Torqeedo for access to a 3HP Ultralight 1103 AC motor so that I can devise a mount for it that will properly work on the Hobie AI/TI.

Please watch this thread or my other Torqeedo thread for the results. If Torqeedo allows me access to this motor I will devise a mounting interface that others will be able to replicate and then test the motor's operation on the Hobie TI as I did with the 1HP 403 series.

Many of you have requested both a mounting interface for the 1103 AC motor as well as a comprehensive review before you consider buying one. I hope to be able to provide this shortly if I can get Torqeedo to help with access to one of them. Normally I would just buy the motor myself, but I already own a 403 and these units are costly, so this time around I need to ask for help.

I think this 3HP motor will be ideal for the TI once a proper mount interface is designed and tested. This is vital since Torqeedo has now gone exclusively to their new mount for all of their Ultralight series motors, not just the 3HP model. You can still buy the original-style mount for the 1HP model but at a considerable extra cost. So, if the Torqeedo Ultralight series of motors are to be used going forward, a new mount interface for the AI/TI is critical.

I'll let everyone here know the results, whatever happens.

Update:

A couple of weeks ago, Torqeedo finally replied to my request for access to a 3HP Ultralight 1103 AC motor so that I can devise a mount for it that will properly work on the Hobie AI/TI. They apologized for the delay as my request had to be routed from the service team to the sales team. However, I am very impressed that they cared to reply.

I was contacted by the Director of OEM & Retail Sales. She expressed an interest in this, stating that it is important for Torqeedo customers to see product versatility and how a specific installation will work with their model boat.

To facilitate this, I was offered a significant discount on an 1103AC motor. While this was an admittedly decent offer, my out-of-pocket cost for it would still be nearly $2,000. If I didn't already own a Torqeedo 403 motor that I paid around $1,500 for as well as a Suzuki outboard motor which cost me around $800, I might have purchased the 1103AC. But I simply could not justify paying nearly $2,000 for yet another motor for my TI when I already own two.

I explained this to Torqeedo and offered to pay $1,000 for an 1103AC, even if it was a used, returned, cosmetically damaged, or second-hand one which they could not sell as new. I was hoping that they would see the clear benefit in this since expertly developing, testing, and documenting online a properly working and replicable mounting solution for a TI/AI and other rudder-equipped kayaks could probably significantly increase sales of their entire line of Ultralight motors which now all use the new mounting system.

Unfortunately, this did not go over well with them. They felt that I was out to get a "free motor" and abruptly ended the discussion. This was simply not the case. I offered to pay over half of their cost for the motor. Additionally, I was willing to offer my valuable time and professional engineering expertise. I am a retired Senior Advisory IBM electromechanical engineer with over 40 years of experience designing, building, and testing highly complex semiconductor production tooling. I was willing to design and document a fully tested and easily replicable working mount for their newer Ultralight mounting system that is incompatible with rudder-equipped kayaks as currently sold. This should have been easily worth the shared cost of a new or used 1103AC motor which I calculate would have been only a few hundred dollars of their corporate out-of-pocket costs after I paid them $1,000. Corporations pay millions for advertising and subcontracting, this should have been nothing more than petty cash to them. My professional engineering time as a consultant is worth over $300/hour and I estimate it would take at least 100 hours to design, build, test, and document a mounting solution. If Torqeedo subcontracted this to an engineer of my skills, it would easily cost them $30,000 or more. I offered this for free as well as to pay them over half of their cost of the motor. For a mere few hundred dollars, they would have been able to open up sales of the 1103AC and all of their other newer Ultralight motors to all Hobie owners as well as many other rudder-equipped kayaks.

Nevertheless, they refused. I apologize to all the interested Hobie owners looking for a working mounting solution for the 1103AC. I tried my best but I didn't have the success with Torqeedo that I was hoping for. In all fairness, they did offer to take a look at my battery which suddenly and inexplicably stopped working, although I don't yet know what will become of that since I haven't yet heard back from them after shipping it. So at least there is some hope for me on that.

I again urge anyone interested to contact Torqeedo and ask them for a solution to mount the 1103AC to a Hobie. This motor would probably be a superb way to power a TI/AI. With 3HP and a remote throttle, it appears to be an excellent motor option if only there was a way to mount it. I'm certain I could resolve this if I could just get my hands on one. Perhaps I'll try to sell my 403 to fund purchasing one, but for now, I simply can't justify the cost of owning three motors for one boat.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2021 5:16 am 
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Two modifications I’ve used on my torqeedo for coastal sailing.

1. I had to remove the shock cord for holding the motor in the down position. In rough seas it just kicked up too much and caused error messages.

2. I made short ‘legs’ by glueing pieces of foam noodles to the bottom. This just keeps the battery drier.

So far both mods have been improvements.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2021 8:02 am 
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HobieTI wrote:
Two modifications I’ve used on my torqeedo for coastal sailing.

1. I had to remove the shock cord for holding the motor in the down position. In rough seas it just kicked up too much and caused error messages.

2. I made short ‘legs’ by glueing pieces of foam noodles to the bottom. This just keeps the battery drier.

So far both mods have been improvements.

The problem with removing the shock cord entirely is that you won't have any kick-up protection if you hit something. A rigid line could result in motor damage. Every outboard should be able to kick up if it hits something.

I've significantly modified the shock cord setup since my first design. Use a very thick shock cord only long enough to provide about six inches of expansion. This will reduce or eliminate unwanted kick-ups yet still provide enough movement to protect the motor if you hit something underwater.

Just a quick note when attaching anything to the battery, be aware that there is a tiny one-way vent hole to equalize the internal pressure. Never cover this hole, it must be able to function normally. It's so small that it can easily be missed.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:08 pm 
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pro10is wrote:
pro10is wrote:
Now that the boating season is finally underway where I live, I've asked Torqeedo for access to a 3HP Ultralight 1103 AC motor so that I can devise a mount for it that will properly work on the Hobie AI/TI.

Please watch this thread or my other Torqeedo thread for the results. If Torqeedo allows me access to this motor I will devise a mounting interface that others will be able to replicate and then test the motor's operation on the Hobie TI as I did with the 1HP 403 series.

Many of you have requested both a mounting interface for the 1103 AC motor as well as a comprehensive review before you consider buying one. I hope to be able to provide this shortly if I can get Torqeedo to help with access to one of them. Normally I would just buy the motor myself, but I already own a 403 and these units are costly, so this time around I need to ask for help.

I think this 3HP motor will be ideal for the TI once a proper mount interface is designed and tested. This is vital since Torqeedo has now gone exclusively to their new mount for all of their Ultralight series motors, not just the 3HP model. You can still buy the original-style mount for the 1HP model but at a considerable extra cost. So, if the Torqeedo Ultralight series of motors are to be used going forward, a new mount interface for the AI/TI is critical.

I'll let everyone here know the results, whatever happens.

Update:

A couple of weeks ago, Torqeedo finally replied to my request for access to a 3HP Ultralight 1103 AC motor so that I can devise a mount for it that will properly work on the Hobie AI/TI. They apologized for the delay as my request had to be routed from the service team to the sales team. However, I am very impressed that they cared to reply.

I was contacted by the Director of OEM & Retail Sales. She expressed an interest in this, stating that it is important for Torqeedo customers to see product versatility and how a specific installation will work with their model boat.

To facilitate this, I was offered a significant discount on an 1103AC motor. While this was an admittedly decent offer, my out-of-pocket cost for it would still be nearly $2,000. If I didn't already own a Torqeedo 403 motor that I paid around $1,500 for as well as a Suzuki outboard motor which cost me around $800, I might have purchased the 1103AC. But I simply could not justify paying nearly $2,000 for yet another motor for my TI when I already own two.

I explained this to Torqeedo and offered to pay $1,000 for an 1103AC, even if it was a used, returned, cosmetically damaged, or second-hand one which they could not sell as new. I was hoping that they would see the clear benefit in this since expertly developing, testing, and documenting online a properly working and replicable mounting solution for a TI/AI and other rudder-equipped kayaks could probably significantly increase sales of their entire line of Ultralight motors which now all use the new mounting system.

Unfortunately, this did not go over well with them. They felt that I was out to get a "free motor" and abruptly ended the discussion. This was simply not the case. I offered to pay over half of their cost for the motor. Additionally, I was willing to offer my valuable time and professional engineering expertise. I am a retired Senior Advisory IBM electromechanical engineer with over 40 years of experience designing, building, and testing highly complex semiconductor production tooling. I was willing to design and document a fully tested and easily replicable working mount for their newer Ultralight mounting system that is incompatible with rudder-equipped kayaks as currently sold. This should have been easily worth the shared cost of a new or used 1103AC motor which I calculate would have been only a few hundred dollars of their corporate out-of-pocket costs after I paid them $1,000. Corporations pay millions for advertising and subcontracting, this should have been nothing more than petty cash to them. My professional engineering time as a consultant is worth over $300/hour and I estimate it would take at least 100 hours to design, build, test, and document a mounting solution. If Torqeedo subcontracted this to an engineer of my skills, it would easily cost them $30,000 or more. I offered this for free as well as to pay them over half of their cost of the motor. For a mere few hundred dollars, they would have been able to open up sales of the 1103AC and all of their other newer Ultralight motors to all Hobie owners as well as many other rudder-equipped kayaks.

Nevertheless, they refused. I apologize to all the interested Hobie owners looking for a working mounting solution for the 1103AC. I tried my best but I didn't have the success with Torqeedo that I was hoping for. In all fairness, they did offer to take a look at my battery which suddenly and inexplicably stopped working, although I don't yet know what will become of that since I haven't yet heard back from them after shipping it. So at least there is some hope for me on that.

I again urge anyone interested to contact Torqeedo and ask them for a solution to mount the 1103AC to a Hobie. This motor would probably be a superb way to power a TI/AI. With 3HP and a remote throttle, it appears to be an excellent motor option if only there was a way to mount it. I'm certain I could resolve this if I could just get my hands on one. Perhaps I'll try to sell my 403 to fund purchasing one, but for now, I simply can't justify the cost of owning three motors for one boat.


pro10is … I sent you a PM


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2021 1:04 pm 
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Location: Gulf Shores, Alabama
When the Torqeedo 1103AC was announced, it grabbed my interest despite the hefty price tag. More power, longer range and after a day of sailing you can completely remove the motor from the boat in under a minute. There’s also a method to temporary lock the motor in position for going in reverse. The bracket’s shape had me wondering if it could even be mounted to a TI. The only way to know for sure was to just buy one and give it my best shot. If unsuccessful, it would be fairly easy to resell.

A noisy outboard motor and carrying fuel wasn’t something that appealed to me. Plus, being a front seat TI sailor, the throttle and controls needed to be accessible to the front seat.

Initially I looked at mounting it to the stern using the same area the Torqeedo 403’s ball was mounted. The stern of the TI is quite rounded so the motor mount would have to take that into account. It was quickly evident it was impossible to hang directly behind the TI because of the rudder. But I did try three unsuccessful prototypes hanging it to the side of the stern. It is a HEAVY motor.

After abandoning the idea of it being on the stern, I considered PRO10s outboard motor mount design using yakattack rails on the edge of the TI just forward of the rear hatch. Rails installed with the reinforcing backing plate inside the TI. The instructions for that and links to the hardware were posted by PRO10s at the beginning of this thread. I used 2” yakattack mighty bolts to attach the motor mount because I wanted extra length on the bolts in case I decided to attached wood or a composite board on top of the aluminum which didn’t happen. During the build process, I corresponded with PRO10s to bounce ideas off him.

I no longer have access to a local metal supply company so I used aluminum in my miscellaneous bin and Lowes / Home Depot supplied the other ¾” square aluminum tubes. Aluminum diamond plate from lowes was added for additional strength. Probably not necessary but why not.

Initially I was going to use two strong heavy duty steel bars. Despite weight and the obvious rust issues, there would have been only 4 attachment points to the yakattack rails. Using 5 aluminum square tubes I could spread the load out on the yak attack bars with 10+ attachment points. I’m not an engineer but that just seemed to make more sense. And using steel just didn’t feel right.

Blocks were needed to reduce friction of the line used to raise and lower the motor. The same harken cleats that Hobie uses for the main sail and a Harken Micro cheek block H233 was used by the large front hatch. Another block was attached to the Torqeedo motor mount to reduce friction pulling up the heavy motor.

I happened to have an extra long cable to go from the throttle to the battery. If you’re going to use it in the front seat you’ll need that. My TI is ready for a test run. We have some wet weather this week so it may be a couple weeks before it gets on the water. This mount feels very strong.
Image
Image
Image
Image


Last edited by CaptnChaos on Tue Oct 05, 2021 4:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:27 am 
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Excellent work!

I'm really looking forward to the final results. Please post on the performance of the 1103AC on a TI. As far as I know, you're one of the first, if not the first, to successfully mount this motor to the TI. The big mystery is how this motor performs with this boat. Performance should be comparable to the Suzuki 2.5HP outboard without all the noise, gas, and exhaust fumes. This would make the 1103AC one of the best motor options for the TI.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 3:30 pm 
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This is a link to a video how my final design works. I took this, this morning just before we went sailing with the new 1103AC torqeedo motor. I'll post more details later, but for now I will say it could not have been any better. I love this new motor and it does exactly what I want in a motor. Performance was amazing and it was whisper quiet. It made for a fun day of sailing. My wife loves the new motor also.

Here's a quick walkaround video https://youtu.be/reXx8EwyWCI


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