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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 6:14 am 
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My wife has a Mirage sport with an old hull that leaks water and we want to replace it. She wants a kayak but I enjoy sailing. I have a older sailboat but rigging it is an 2 man multi hour affair and the hull weighs 200 lbs so I cant easily do this by myself. We are both 60 years old if that is important. My question is, how is the AI2 as a Kayak? It's a very long boat and I am concerned she might see it as too big to use as a kayak. I would like to hear from any women or men here if they take their AI's out as kayaks and whether the boat is compromised as a kayak. Is the Ai2 an ocean only sailboat or is it equally enjoyable on a smaller lake?

I should add that this kayak will reside at a lake home, there is no need to car top it (other than the initial transport) The lake is 7 miles long with width varying from 1 to 2 miles. The lake is connected by locks that attach it to a system 200 miles long if that helps


Last edited by rbrunelle on Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Location: Blacklick, Ohio
We've stripped our TI down to kayak mode. It's still quite a lot of boat at 18.5'. However, with 2 people it was manageable. Still a very stable and capable kayak. With both of us pedalling at a walking pace we easily held 3-4 knots. From a dead stop we tried a sprint and were able to hit 5.7 knots (BTW these were GPS measured). Obviously we couldn't hold that speed very long. I can only imagine that the AI2 is just as capable.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:11 pm 
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The AI1 makes for an exceptional kayak. The AI2, due to changes to make it a slightly better sailing vessel, is not quite as nimble, agile nor fast as the AI1 when used purely in kayak mode. But it'll work that way for sure. The weight is perhaps the only thing you or she may find objectionable. It really all depends on how you plan to transport and launch it.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:46 pm 
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Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
My wife and I are long time kayakers, and one of our favorite things is kayak sailing. Actually we have never taken a hobie mirage kayak out without a kayak sail strapped to the side of the boat, (not even once), in over ten years, just in case we find favorable wind. When we first started out we always had separate kayaks but our physical abilities are quite different, as a result nearly every other time we went out her legs turned to rubber and I would need to tow her back to launch. It always took me longer to setup and rig two kayaks vs one. We eventually sold all the singles and only use tandems now. Of course we know all tandems are bulkier and always heavier. But it beats by a huge factor having to get down two complete boats and get them all setup, I do all the work alone always.
I have zero experience on the AI1 or the AI2, and have never been in one. However I see many similar traits between the boats.
We have owned many different hobie kayaks and as a kayak only, the TI kayak is by a large margin the fastest and finest kayak in Hobies fleet, the best kayak we have ever owned.
If the AI2 kayak is similar then it's a very good kayak in my opinion. Plus it comes with sails and AMA's if you want to use them.
Just my 2 cente
FE
Edit: keep in mind we live in swfl and the keys and mostly go offshore ,salt water coastal) so a (inland) recreational kayak would never be sufficient for us. Our only interest is touring type sea kayaks, (not recreational), and must be tandem (as explained above,,,I was a touring canoe type person since the age of 12, (scouting), (that pre dates kayaks (lol)). This narrows our selection to basically either a Kruger cruiser, or Hobie Tandem Island. The TI is easily modified and hardened, (we have massive sailsets and twin outboards on ours, along with a widened boat (now almost 13ft wide, with up to 260 sq ft of sail), and a slightly modified planing type hull for an extra 100 lbs of flotation), this brought our total investment up to about equal to the base Kruger Cruiser. We have a rather large family, and this being our only family boat often have 4-6 people along, (we have a 4 person inflatable that we keep in the front hatch that we tow behind the TI), we keep our coolers, scuba tanks and gear in the dingy, (only when needed). As a mothership we have towed the dingy and as many as 3 additional kayaks out to remote islands, our main thing is snorkling and scuba diving btw.
What we have in my opinion is the only car toppable family sailboat that I know of, with a 100 mile per day range. My humble opinion is with an equally modded out AI2, it would be equally as capable as a mother ship in nearly all conditions that you can throw at her, just slightly less people on board, (you would need to tow the additional people/kayaks, (not a problem). My opinion is these adventure boats live up to their reputation, and there is nothing equal on the market, or on anyones drawing boards, plus they are truly good kayaks without all the extras (we use ours kayak only about half the time, mostly inshore).
All just my opinions.

Obviously our needs are totally different, however we have well over 200k road miles with our camper in tow and Hobies on the roof (can't use our trailer when we are pulling the camper), 95% of the time when we are out and about, we are in small inland lakes and rivers similar to your situation, many times in kayak only mode, (all the extras remain back at the campsite).
Actually we just got back yesterday from a 3 month 14,000 mile adventure (we visited as many national parks as possible,,, a bucket list thing).
This is our setup, just in case anyone is remotely interested. Unfortunately out west they have the quagar mussle and zebra snail problem (all lakes and bodies of water are quarantined, with inspection stations alongside all roads leading into any of those areas where all boats must pull over and submit to inspection, (yes kayaks too), about every 30 miles anywhere near any parks, so we put the boat in storage for half the trip (boy did I miss it). We missed Bull Shoals, lake powell, Lake Mead, Lake yellowstone, Lake havasu, deer lake (near orem utah), and of course the great salt lake, and lakes mcdonald and mary at glacier, plus many others and a gazzilian cool rivers like the yellowstone, and Colorado rivers.

This is our setup, I'm 5'6" tall mid 60's, 200 lbs not in good shape, and I load/unload everything myself with no help of any kind. Obviously when we are in Florida
(not camping) we only use the trailer, which is a huge time saver.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaTem8xTgkU



Last edited by fusioneng on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:28 am 
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Thanks for your replies. I added to the original post, we don't plan on moving this kayak, we use it at our lake home for exercise and just something to do on a pleasant day. I would likely get the cart to move it in and out of the lake hopefully that would make it easier on my wife to launch


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:41 am 
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Location: High Point, NC
How small is your lake? The AI is a great sailboat on small or large bodies of water. Perhaps not a "pond" but anything larger is fair game. Your wife may find that after sailing the boat, it'll be all she wants to do with it.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:26 am 
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Location: Chalfont Pa
That depends on the type of kayak she is used to using. The center of gravity is higher than a sit-in, and IMHO they do not paddle as well as a sit in. BUT they go quite well with the mirage drive, and the rudder makes it very maneuverable. So I vote yes but advise going somewhere to try one first. Hobie dealers are pretty good about this and offer demo days all the time.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:51 pm 
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Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
That's very good advise to go to a demo days where you can try out many different kayaks and select the one that suits your lifestyle best, (that's exactly what we did). We eventually selected and grew into the adventure line because it's so versatile, basically a single boat that can be used as a real sailboat, and also a very capable and nice high end kayak. We sold our 24ft searay, and all three of our other kayaks and only have the TI now. What we have fits our lifestyle but I doubt very much it would be a good fit for someone who just wants a small lightweight kayak (like a revo 11), and just peddles around a small lake once in a while.
FE


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 10:24 am 
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Location: Paoli Pennsylvania - East Coast USA
rbrunelle wrote:
My question is, how is the AI2 as a Kayak?

As a 2015 AI owner -and a surf ski paddler - my opinion is that the AI2 is too much of a pig for real-world paddling.

The Revo is realistic paddle-wise, but whatever they did to the hull shape for the AI limits it to a realistic speed of about 3.5 mph - and that is for somebody who can do back-to-back miles on their beginner's-shape surfski at 6 mph.

YMMV...

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:12 pm 
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These boats (AI, AI2, TI) are pigs for paddling. The cross bars interfere for starters. Now, they are capable "kayaks" when pedaled using the mirage drives. Would you and wife consider that route?

I like the idea somebody above posted: maybe, after your wife sails on a TI, she will like it. Problem solved. Your lake is plenty big enough to enjoy a good sail.

Keith

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:42 pm 
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I've paddled my AI1 probably over 1,000 miles I'd estimate. It makes a fine paddler. Haven't tried the AI2 -- was turned off by its size for loading/unloading on the car, but once in the water I doubt it is much different. The crossbars don't block paddling at all (unless you have AMAs attached). I like to go back and forth with the paddles and peddles. It's fun and very stable. I go 8-25 miles at a time in kayak mode.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:42 am 
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That's amazing recycle. More power to you!

Yes, any paddling I've done was with the amas/akas installed. Still, I've been a sea kayaker (21.5"wide, 19' long), so I'm afraid I will always view these Hobies as "pigs." As kayak sail boats, they are great!

Keith

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:19 pm 
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recycle wrote:
Haven't tried the AI2 -- was turned off by its size for loading/unloading on the car, but once in the water I doubt it is much different.

I would not be too sure. .... A guy at our local lake has a Revolution that he Mirage Drive paddles for exercise.

I can catch him on my surfski from a half mile away, but by the time I get there I'm ready for the ER.

He holds 6.5-6.7 MPH on the Revo.

Superficially, the Revo and the AI2 hulls looked the same to me and I partially based my purchase decision on the Revo's speed.

Wrong.... The AI2 is way slower than the Revo.... Waaaaaay slower.

I can push my AI2 to 5 or 5.5 mph under the Mirage Drive, but that is strictly anerobic sprint speed. An aerobic pace is more like 3.5-4.

Edit 2918 03-05 10-:26:
Another aspect of the AI2 is deep-water re-mount - which I find quite difficult.

The whole thing is just too far out of the water for me to re-mount with any degree of ease.

With at least one ama deployed, no problem: heave my butt up onto the ama, then slide it over to the main hull on one of the akas.... but with no amas, remounts are problematic.

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Pre-September 2015 cradles
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Last edited by PeteCress on Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:21 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:43 pm 
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On of the issues with paddling an adventure/revo 16 compared to a dedicated paddler is the lack of decent foot rests or bracing. You feel like you are bracing against the sides of a bath tube, and dont feel "at one" with the kayak.

I did three things to overcome this, made up some "thigh straps" simply by using some cam straps fed through the padeyes at fromt of the tank well and the one just in front of the mesh pocket (installed one on the other side too. I always use dry pants or leggings of some sort so dont need bulky padding. Slip your knees into these tighten to suit. Even when not in use pulled taunt they dont get in the way. I have made a fancy version using SS ones, but just a basic tie down stap will do.

I bolted a couple of door stop wedges to the appropriate "foot scollop" to give a much more custom fit and substatial foot rest.

I use a taller drive plug (one from an outback), this gives heel support to aid bracing. Gives a raised dry surface above water level. OEM revo 16 drive plugs are shallow and flush with footwell. Additionally i fitted a bung in the top so that i can fill it with water (or anything) to act as ballast and forward trimming for improved handling.

Additional mods are a couple of different sized skeg/keels made from spare OEM hobie rudder and an acrylic board dropped into daggerboard slot as required (dont think AI2 has this?) helps tracking, turning and extra primary stabilility if, and when, required (will add drag so pull it when not required)

Recently just added the extra small skegs as per https://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=60698&sid=c8eed52fb92a4dfc62b8557f6a70e955. Still have to try them on water yet.

Non of these mods interfere with its use when in pedal mode

The AI2 I believe is heavier, more bouyancy (should help not burying nose in following sees. Taller, could be tippier, but maybe easier to edge. The raised seat on the revo 16 compared to the earlier adventure makes edging a little easier.

For a plastic kayak it makes a good hybrid with a few mods to aid paddling (hobie should put more thought into this as it is the only paddle/pedal hybrid on the market). However compared to a ski or sit in touring kayak it would still feel like a bathtub, but that is payoff of performance vs utility


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:42 am 
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Wow, WAVERIDER, those are some mods. I like your thigh-straps. I must admit, I've owned 3 AIs, 1 AI2, and 1 TI over a period of about 10 yrs, and not once did I ever paddle one in the full kayak mode. Currently, I have the AI2 and TI and never plan to use them in the "kayak mode." They are well-designed kayak sailboats.

Keith

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