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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:40 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 6:38 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania - Philly Area
Need some help. My 2016 TI is taking on a fair bit of water while under sail (about 1" of water inside the hull after 3 hours of sailing).

I pulled the TI up on the beach and did a hull inspection and found a crack in the bottom of the hull near where the mast step is located. Figure with every flex of the mast while under sail water is entering the hull. The rest of the hull looks water tight.

I sail offshore a fair bit and need a water tight setup that I can trust. I carry a hand bilge pump for emergencies....have not had to use it for over 2 years....now I need to pump out the TI every 2 to 3 hours of use!

Questions:

- How best to repair? This looks like a high stress area that gets a fair bit of flexing with the mast.

- How best to tune the "V" bolts to reduce the stress / flexing in this area to prevent future cracks?

- Ideas on how to strengthen this area to prevent future cracks?

See picture of the crack below.

https://flic.kr/p/HPTYn5

ImageHobie TI crack in hull bottom under mast step - taking on water by Jim Powers, on Flickr

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Jim
Hobie TI 2016
Hobie AI 2015 - sold
Hobie Rev 13 2014
Hobie Outback - 2008 - sold


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:56 am
Posts: 39
If your Island is out of warranty I'd try this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krj8QqubZJc

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2018 Tandem Island -


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 2594
Location: High Point, NC
My 2012 AI arrived from the factory with a crack in very nearly the same location as yours. I plastic welded it, without any fillers, wire, etc., and it has held watertight for these past 6 years. Plastic welding should result in a weld that is the same strength as the surrounding plastic. Done correctly, the area will be seamless - returned to as it was before there was a crack. But this does take the correct technique. The surrounding plastic has be to hot, but not too hot. Otherwise you're just dumping some melted plastic into a crack rather than melding everything back into a single piece. There are probably some Youtube videos showing how to do this, but watch several as there is no guarantee that what any particular video shows is really the correct method.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
Posts: 2983
Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
Being a 2016 boat, I highly recommend you don’t touch it, and take to your dealer for evaluation. Hobie is really good about warranty repairs, (especially anything under the waterline).
Chances are you will get a new hull under warranty. Even if the boat is slightly out of warranty hobie will work with you, ((you may need to pay a small amount to help with shipping, (all based on my own experiences with Hobie over the years, ( we have owned bunches of them, ( including 3 TI’s)), they are the most fair over any company I have ever encountered, I will always only use Hobies boats, (huge fan).
If the boat were older and you have exhausted all hull replacement options, then you might want to follow Tom’s advise, (yes it is repairable, but unless your an expert at welding PE I don’t recommend trying to repair yourself, (this is as far from a novice repair as it gets). Many kayak dealers have experts on staff who can easily do such repairs and are experts, (I know our dealer, economy tackle in Sarasota FL, has many experts on staff and I have seen them do many amazing repairs).

If your just running a stock boat without massive sail sets, (all our TI’s were massivly modified with massive salsets, (as much as 260 sq ft). There is no need for concern and really no need to try and re-enforce that area of the boat, (ie... the mast base), beyond just repairing the crack to prevent water intrusion. Most of our hulls were heavily re-enforced in that area, specifically to withstand severe offshore use in extreme conditions, (I highly recommend you don’t do that with these boats), the boat is designed for light recreational sailing, don’t exceed the published design envelope, (ie.. EU ‘D’ certification).
Just so you know, ( fyi) there is a pretty big brass molded in insert just below the surface in that area of the hull, ( to hold the mast).
Hopefully some of this info will help you get this resolved.
FE


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 6:38 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Pennsylvania - Philly Area
All, thanks for the quick reply.

I have reached out to my Hobie dealer. Waiting for a response / corrective action.

The Hobie TI is 2016 model purchased new about this time two years ago.

The TI has seen a fair bit of sailing. I picked up the Hobie TI spinnaker kit back in 2017 and have used the spinnaker on a limited basis. Not certain if this contributed to the crack formation.

The TI is a stock setup with the main sail. No extra sails beyond the spinnaker.

The additional photos below provide a bit more detail.

The crack is just aft of the 2 nut covers directly below where the mast step is. It also looks like a start of an additional minor crack just forward of the two nut covers. The aft crack (main crack) is pressed in a bit and the forward minor crack is pressed out a bit ..... trying to figure out the physics ..... root cause..... if the mast were to tip forward....the forces could present deformation (pressed in at the aft crack and pressed out at the forward minor crack). I do not claim to be an expert....just trying to understand the underlying root cause.

Any thoughts? See a few additional pictures below.

ImageHobie 2016 TI hull crack near mast step by Jim Powers, on Flickr

ImageHobie 2016 TI hull crack near mast step by Jim Powers, on Flickr

ImageHobie 2016 TI hull crack near mast step by Jim Powers, on Flickr

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Jim
Hobie TI 2016
Hobie AI 2015 - sold
Hobie Rev 13 2014
Hobie Outback - 2008 - sold


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:52 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
Posts: 2594
Location: High Point, NC
That second blemish appears to be more of a scrape or cut than a developing crack. Doubtful it's going to become a problem.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:02 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
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Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
The hull is toast, needs to be replaced.
FE


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 6:38 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania - Philly Area
Thanks for the additional feedback. Agree the TI hull needs to be repaired or replaced.

I am waiting for a response from my dealer.

In the mean time - I have been pumping out ....with my hand bilge pump... on a more frequent basis.

Took a brief 2 hour sail in light wind this evening....upon returning to the dock the TI was half full of water. It appears the crack has widened and with the boat moving forward it looks like the crack acts like a scoop underwater.....not the best experience....

I have the TI tied up to a floating dock currently. I am calling it quits till I get the hull repaired or replaced. Not safe to sail. I am planning on pulling the TI out of the water tomorrow and will reinspect the crack.

My dealer is in PA and I am vacationing in South West Florida (Marco Island). Can anyone recommend a good Hobie dealer to do an emergency repair to the hull?

Thanks in advance.

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Jim
Hobie TI 2016
Hobie AI 2015 - sold
Hobie Rev 13 2014
Hobie Outback - 2008 - sold


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 8:48 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
Posts: 2983
Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
Economy tackle in Sarasota fl, they are awesome, and may be able to help.

They are about 2 hrs north of naples.

There may be hobie dealers in naples, ft myers, or port charlotte, but I don’t know them.
If your only in the area for a short time, just go to home depot and pick up some flex tape, a 6x6 patch on the bottom would likely fix you up for the duration of your vacation.
FE


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 9:19 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:25 pm
Posts: 2775
Location: Central Coast NSW Australia
Back in December I used 3M VHB tape to stick two small skegs to the bottom of my Adventure hull. They remain rock solid with zero lifting and this crack looks like it would be a good test for the use of VHB tape as an emergency repair. With the proper hull prep of flaming and IPA cleaning it just might work. You could try the double sided VHB and add a thin sheet of suitable protective plastic etc or try the single sided VHB tape on its own.
More info here:
https://www.hobie.com/au/en/forums/view ... 11&t=60698


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:59 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2015 1:27 pm
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I had a well-crack in my Adventure a few years ago. About two to three hours of kayaking on calm water filled about half the hull with water...

While I was waiting for my new hull to arrive, I filled the crack with silicon (standard stuff you get at the hardware store), and covered it externally with "Gorilla Tape" (on the bottom of the hull), figuring I would replace the tape each trip. To my amazement, the tape held for about six trips (say about 20 hours of kayaking), and the combination had very little leaking. I found it a great temporary solution -- quick, easy, and cheap.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:29 pm
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Location: High Point, NC
For temporary use you can smear a filler of GOOP in the crack, both top and bottom if possible. You might be surprised how well this works and for how long.

The larger issue whether or not the hull is flexing in that area under use. I wonder if your V-Rod truss is overtightened and forcing the hull down in that area. There was a time when some owners mistakenly thought you could use the V-Rod truss to adjust the height of the mast base receiver. If you're not the first owner, the previous owner may have caused the crack by extending the truss rods too far.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:06 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:18 am
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Location: Sarasota,Key West FL
A big ole blob of ge clear silicone around that area on the inside of the hull, (about 1 tubes worth, (maybe $3 bucks worth)) will probably work well. Best part of that is it is all removable, once you get back from vacation, just peel it out of there so repairs can be made.
You could probably put a blob over the outside as well, if desired, but tape will also likely work.
Just tryin to help save your vacation.
FE
Edit: hint, if you spray the area you want the silicone to stick to with a light coat of krylon for plastics clear coat spray paint, the silicone will bond to the polyethylene hull much better. Actually the clear coat will help anything bond way better too the polyethylene hull, including any tapes, epoxies, rubber stuff ( like goop, etc), and boat registration numbers, etc. With the boat registration numbers, spraying a base coat on the hull first, then place the numbers, then overcoat all the lettering with a heavy coat of krylon clear coat, (especially around all edges of the letters), make the lettering and numbers last ten times longer.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:14 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 6:38 pm
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Location: Pennsylvania - Philly Area
All, Thanks for the short term fix recommendations and options for dealer fixes in FL.

I did take my TI for a last sail prior to pulling it out on my trailer this morning.

Prior to pulling the TI up, I beached it one more time for a quick tip up and hull inspection.

See two additional photos below. No big change in the size of the crack over the last few days.

It does look like the hull near the crack is moving around a bit... As stated in prior post the area of the crack appears to be pulled in and the area in front (closer to the bow) is pushed out.

Water was coming in quickly.....would not want to go more than 1 hour without pumping out.

Back to the root cause....I have no proof but suspect the V-Rod trust is out of tune. I purchased the TI new and have made no adjustments to the V-Rod trust. Just trying to figure what could cause the deformation.....and how to get it back to normal flat surface. The other possible factor is the use of the spinnaker with the extra forward and back stress on the mast but I discount this as I have only used the spinnaker on a limited basis ....maybe 10 sails of 15-20 hours total duration. I also reviewed how the TI sits on my trailer (using the Hobie Island cradles) and have discounted this as the area of the leak is clear of the cradle support surface area.

I plan to explore various short term fixes along the lines mentioned by others in this thread. Going forward, as an offshore sailor....I am thinking of carrying a small emergency patch kit on the boat. This will be a good opportunity to try out one or two repair options and see what floats :-)

Hope to get the TI back to my dealer for inspection / repair / hull replace next week.

ImageTI Hull Leak Crack near mast step by Jim Powers, on Flickr

ImageTI Hull Leak Crack near mast step by Jim Powers, on Flickr

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Jim
Hobie TI 2016
Hobie AI 2015 - sold
Hobie Rev 13 2014
Hobie Outback - 2008 - sold


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:06 am
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I have a similar problem with my 2014 TI, except that the crack is propagating from the hole where the plug is. It was fine until a few months ago but now takes on a few inches of water every hour of sailing. At this stage I think plastic welding is the only hope for this hull. I don't plan to take it on myself but will use one recommended by my dealer. Makes you wonder if this is a weakness in all the hulls.
<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/156575852@N07/40711061084/in/dateposted-public/" title="IMG_2849"><img src="https://farm1.staticflickr.com/790/40711061084_42725a7573_k.jpg" width="1536" height="2048" alt="IMG_2849"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Last edited by intune on Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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