Solved Steering Issue (limited rudder sweep)

Just thought I would post an update in case anyone ever has rudder/steering problems, and needs another avenue.

TL;DR - it was a knot in the limiter that made the limiter too short for the handle to move the rudder full sweep

Was out sailing on Sunday, and once the wind picked up I lost the ability to steer port, and steering to starboard was very slow). I've always thought the steering from the rear seat (where I always sit) was dismal, but this is the first time I could actually not steer through wind. I decided then that I would completely disassemble and re-install the steering. I am one of a very small number of people that have steering concerns, so I'm sure it wasn't "just how it is".

I ended up doing a lot of poking, prodding, and taking pictures inside the hull of the TI to figure it out and see if there was an obvious problem. I found a cable of possible concern and was able to roll it off the stud on the aft steering handle, leaving it hanging loosely from the string going to the forward steering handle.

This pretty much disabled the ability to steer from the rear (would only steer one direction), but it allowed me to adjust the rudder for the front handle, and found that with just the front attached, the steering worked almost perfectly (no stiffness, rudder had almost an inch of extra sweep). So then I knew it was an issue with the rear...

Next I disconnected the steering line from the rudder, pulled the guide tubes out, and started digging around more (at this point I still didn't fully grasp how all the lines interconnected). Finding no issues with the lines running aft of port quarter I reinstalled the guide tubes and lines, and started tracing every inch I could reach with my fingers. The last thing I checked was a line running directly from the rear handle to the starboard side (later identified as a "limiter"?). I felt a figure eight knot in the middle of the string, and although thinking "how much difference could a little knot on a random string make", I decided to just remove the string and take out the knot...


With an allen key, I removed the yoke from the front handle (inside the hull)


which gave me enough slack to remove the steering line loops from the knob at the rear handle, and was able to pull the knotted string out of the 8" hatch and remove the knot. I put all back together again (3 loops onto the knob at the rear handle, re-install the yoke, reattach the lines to the rudder), this time in a way that ensures they won't slip through the little screws on the rudder, and found that rear steering now works just like the front!







So if anyone ever has issues where their steering doesn't seem to swing fully, check that limiter line; if its guitar-string tight and the rudder is not fully turned, it could be the issue.

I hope this helps someone in the future. The steering was one of the most disappointing things about this boat, and I was getting close to just figuring out a way to install a tiller directly to the rudder. Hopefully I will get a chance to test it out this week...but I'm thinking with an extra inch of rudder sweep each direction, it will be much better.

Good post. What year TI is this? Did you get an pictures that you can share?

RickO, thank you.

Its a 2021, just took delivery about 1 month ago (and my first Hobie) and have been slowly shaking out the faults and refining the transportation over 4 sailing trips; there were not many faults, the steering being that major one which I posted in another thread looking for advice.

I did take a few pictures, and will try to get them up in an edited main post. Just a heads up though, these were taken so I could see what was going on underneath, not really for mass consumption, so the quality will be very...well, not quality.

Keen observers will notice the problem with the front yoke...one that I didn't notice until I reviewed these pictures.

For all the pics, feel free to see the post here: https://imgur.com/a/3DkqDDU

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Knuckles
2021 Hobie TI

Thanks. That will be helpful for future reference.

Thanks heaps for going to the time of posting your story and pictures - will undoubtedly be of assistance to many people.

I was also going to chime in to say there looks like a couple of bits of plastic broken/breaking - if by the front yoke, you mean the picture with the spring touching the plastic that looks broken, then looks like others have already spotted it.

Cheers!
Michael.

Michael, I honestly didn't notice the cracks. I'm curious what a failure there would do to the steering? My comment was about the little rod above the yoke that should not be sticking out...similar to the steering handles, it should be nestled in a groove to keep everything from spinning independently.

I'll reach out to Hobie about the crack though, just to get there take on it. Maybe I will still figure out an emergency tiller set up.

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Knuckles
2021 Hobie TI

I found a few diagrams posted last year by mmiller here:
https://www.hobie.com/forums/viewtopic. ... 17&t=44479

in case people have issues getting orientated with my above pictures:

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Knuckles
2021 Hobie TI

Update: Hobie replied to my email stating "That insert bracket will not have an issue – it’s molded into the hull and held with screws from outside – they will always have that look. All kayaks with molded brackets will do that, it’s normal." So I guess its not something I need to worry about.

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Knuckles
2021 Hobie TI

Another thing people can try if they have steering problems... I was struggling one day and realized that the line that holds the rudder in the down position was too tight. I gave it an inch of slack and it was fixed.

Interesting...that's almost the opposite of what I keep hearing. Everyone keeps saying that it needs to be pulled down hard...like "don't worry about snapping the line" hard. I'm going to try your idea next time out.

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Knuckles
2021 Hobie TI

Great post, thanks

I have a 2013 Oasis with limiter (over-rotate) issue plus a different rudder issue (tighter turn on the right than Left). I wish I had found this thread earlier, instead of spending last whole week for try-and-error with the tandem line. Anyway, Here are my 2 cents.

I like to have the limiter in the front. So I added a piece of string and connected to a screw (F) at the front map mesh pocket as a limiter
(see picture below). There is alway someone sitting in the back seat. So if the back controller is over rotated and lock the front controller. The person can always correct the controller to unlock the front controller.

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipNJggqRWt5A3hkxPZudmXz71Gjfq3ZOQDgn18nR/photo/AF1QipNr4Eq8o3iOOqKSXt2Uuwn2CdNTO-AprZA2F1rq

Below is my solution for the 2nd issue,

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipNJggqRWt5A3hkxPZudmXz71Gjfq3ZOQDgn18nR/photo/AF1QipNtzjluF_eNI9R4XuBUm0_AlrdTU-8q4jl32nwf (google photo)

In 2013 Oasis, there are 3 sections of strings. (see photo above) #1.A<-E->D #2.B<->C #3.D<->C
#1&2 strings tension are controlled by the screws at point A&B. The tricky part is the 3rd section line between C&D which is between the front and back controller. This string line needs to be precise. So the controllers can be in-sync totally. Any slack of the line tension would have an impact to the turn. Once C&D string is set, then make sure both the controllers are in the middle and pull the lines thr A&B to secure the tension.

*Tighter R turn (than L turn) is common with older duo controller (I think). R turn is controlled by the line tension (B&C) which is shorter and simpler. This explains a better right turn. The Left turn is controlled by the lines (A&D) (C&D) which is longer and plus a pulley in the middle. Also if C&D does not have the precise length. It also has the impact to the L turn.

* This diagram works for Oasis, Outfitter or TI tandem duo control kayaks. Even with controller cranks point to the port side.

*Last, you can remove the lines ((A&D) and (C&D) from the front controller crank which will disable the front controller. Then you don't have to worry about 1. the front controller over rotate 2. it has better left turn..

Enjoy your reading~

I just took my rudder lines off, and also found a few extra knots in the lines, I guess as install adjustments. I took the one out from the crossover limiter and now my two rudder handles line up (better). One other thing I noticed in your photos...the one that shows the crack, spring and such...On mine, the black plastic pulley type thing has an indent perfectly fitting the metal pin below the spring. I think the pin needs to be in the indent, to prevent the pin from working its way out, and to make the black pulley thing fit perpendicular to the rudder handle shaft.