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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2022 8:22 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:48 pm
Posts: 278
Location: Missoula, Montana
I own a 12’ Pro Angler 360 with a serial number which ends in 21, and which I bought in October 2021. A couple of weeks ago I was jigging in deep water, using the 360 drive to hold myself stationary over the bottom, when the 360 drive began to jam and make grinding noises. Then it got stuck, pointing at right angles to the keel. I later discovered that the belt in the 360 mechanism had broken. I was a mile and a half from my launch site, and couldn’t remove my 360 drive because it was positioned at a right angle to the drive hole. I removed my fish finder and rod holder from the H-Rails to make it easier to paddle, pushed one pedal forward to bring the fins up against the bottom of the kayak, and paddled back to my launch site. When I got to shore, I climbed out of the kayak in a couple feet of water, reached under the kayak and rotated the drive so it was pointing straight forward, and removed the drive before I beached the kayak. Then I went home.

Here's a couple of initial recommendations: (1) If your 360 drive starts to grind and stick, don’t force it. The belt may merely be out of adjustment. If you force it, you may break the belt. If the belt isn’t broken, you or your dealer may be able to fix the problem with a fairly easy adjustment to the belt tension. (2) If your 360 drive steering mechanism starts to grind and stick, try to gently rotate the drive so it is pointing straight forward, and then leave it there. This will allow you to pedal back to shore, and will allow you to remove the drive before you land. (3) If you can’t rotate your drive using the 360 handle, you may still be able to rotate the drive by hand so it is pointing straight forward. One option is to climb out of the kayak into the water, reach under the kayak, and gently turn the drive. The other is to paddle to shore, roll the kayak on its side, and gently turn the drive. Either option will allow you to pedal your kayak back to your launch site, and may let you complete a day of fishing, although without any 360 maneuvering.

Fortunately, the salesman at the dealership from which I bought the kayak is very knowledgeable about the repair and replacement of Hobie kayaks. He said that Hobie would replace the entire 360 drive steering mechanism under warranty. He said that I could either bring the kayak to the dealership and he would replace the steering mechanism, or he could send me the steering mechanism and I could replace it myself with the assistance of a detailed instructional video - https://www.youtube.com/embed/UTWFxWeBi ... =light&amp. Although I’m an experienced DIY guy, the replacement process looked a bit daunting. But because I live 550 miles (about 8.5 hours) from the dealership, and suspected that it could take several days to get the mechanism replaced, I decided to replace the mechanism myself. The salesman shipped the replacement steering mechanism to me. I put my Pro Angler up on sawhorses and was able to replace the 360 steering mechanism. I would watch 30 seconds of the video, perform those steps, and then watch the next section of the video. The new steering mechanism worked fine when the kayak was sitting on sawhorses. However, the first time that I went fishing in the kayak, the 360 steering mechanism made grinding noises and wouldn’t rotate. The salesman diagnosed the problem as being caused by the belt not being tight enough, so I tightened the belt somewhat. The second time I went fishing in the kayak, the steering mechanism still stuck a lot, but I could gently and slowly inch the 360 steering mechanism around if I pedaled slowly while turning the handle. That time I brought the 5/32” hex wrench required to tighten the belt with me. I beached the kayak, pulled out two foam blocks, and tightened the belt further. Finally, the steering mechanism worked perfectly.

Here's a couple more recommendations about what to do if your 360 control belt breaks: (1) If the dealership from which you bought your Pro Angler has a person who is experienced at repairing Hobie kayaks, and specifically 360 drive kayaks, have that person replace the 360 steering mechanism. Then if the replacement steering mechanism doesn’t work perfectly, or later breaks because it wasn’t adjusted properly, you can blame the dealership, and should be able to get a second steering mechanism under warranty. (2) If the dealership from which you bought your kayak doesn’t have an employee who has a lot of experience in repairing 360 drive kayaks, and you have good mechanical skills, you’ll probably do just as good a job at replacing the steering mechanism as somebody at the dealership, with the help of the video referred to above, which is detailed and excellent. (3) Throughout the process of replacing the 360 steering mechanism, I made repeated calls to the salesman from whom I bought the kayak. He had replaced half a dozen 360 steering mechanisms, and his assistance was invaluable. If you can’t locate a knowledgeable person at your dealership or at Hobie who can help you through the process, it will be a lot harder to replace the steering mechanism and get it adjusted properly. (4) In order to replace a 360 steering mechanism, you often need to reach way inside the kayak. If you don’t have long arms, you better enlist a friend with long arms to help you during the replacement process. (5) You’ll need to put your Pro Angler up on sawhorses or something else at least a foot and a half high while replacing the 360 steering mechanism so you can take the 360 drive in and out while doing the replacement. A disadvantage of putting the kayak on sawhorses is that they are so high that when you need to reach way inside the kayak, you’ll need to stand on a stool. So try to find something lower than sawhorses to rest the kayak on while you work on it. (6) An advantage of replacing the 360 steering mechanism yourself is that you will learn how to get the mechanism adjusted, and should be able to fix problems if they arise in the future. For example, if after several years of use the belt in your steering mechanism stretches and begins to grind and jam, you should recognize the problem and be able to quickly fix it by tightening the belt.

So that’s my story. If further issues arise with my replacement 360 steering mechanism in the coming weeks, I’ll update this post.


Last edited by pmmpete on Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:52 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2022 8:28 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 15021
Location: Oceanside, California
PA 12 360 Support videos:

https://www.hobie.com/support/mirage-pr ... echnology/

_________________
Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2022 8:44 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:48 pm
Posts: 278
Location: Missoula, Montana
There's a lot of great information at the link which Matt Miller sent in the previous reply. For example, if your 360 steering mechanism starts to grind and stick, the video at https://www.youtube.com/embed/rZqRBNUg- ... light& shows how to adjust the tension on the belt in the mechanism.

The biggest problems I had when replacing my 360 steering mechanism involved the steering lines. These issues and my thoughts about them are as follows:

1. Take a look at the steering line diagram which is available at https://media.hobie.com/digital_assets/ ... iagram.pdf. The diagram doesn't show that the left front pulley is attached by a short cord to a "boa" tightening device which is located on the inside of the left gunwale a couple of inches in front of the front left corner of the kayak seat. The boa is used to tighten the steering lines by pulling the left front pulley toward the boa device. Before you start replacing the 360 steering system, locate the steering line which runs from side to side across the kayak underneath the deck and behind the rectangular hatch in front of the kayak seat. This line weaves through the 360 steering tube and a couple of other lines, through the pulley attached to the boa, and then back to the arm on the left steering handle. Trace the route of this line with your hands, and take notes on its route, and whether it goes under or over the steering tube and the other lines as it runs through the pulley and back to the arm on the steering handle. Take pictures of the route of the line with your phone or a camera if you can. This will help you re-install the steering lines correctly after you replace the 360 steering mechanism.

2. There are loops at each end of the steering lines about 3/8" (1 cm) in diameter. These loops are created by metal clips which clamp the steering line. These loops go over the head of a rivet on the arm attached to the left steering mechanism. When the steering line is tight you won't be able to remove the loops from the rivet. Pull out on the knob of the boa, which will loosen the steering line, and then reach inside the kayak and pull the left front pulley towards the stern as far as you can. This should create enough slack to let you pull the steering line loops off the rivet. If that step doesn't create enough slack, unscrew the cover on the stern deck to expose the cam and steering lines which control the rudder, use a Sharpie or other waterproof marker to mark the lines at the place where they go through the holes in the cam, and then take out the left screw to loosen the steering line. Note the way that the steering line is looped around the screw before you remove the line from the screw so you can re-install the steering line on the cam after you have replaced the 360 steering mechanism.

3. One steering line runs between the left front pulley and the left steering arm, and the other steering line runs between the rudder cam in the stern and the left steering arm. I was worried that after I removed the rear line, it would slide back towards the stern of the kayak and be difficult to find and grab so I could re-attach it to the steering arm. So I took a six foot (2 meter) long piece of thin cord, tied a loop about four inches (10 cm) long at the end of the cord, looped the cord around the rear steering line by wrapping the loop around the steering line and pulling the end of the cord through the loop, snugged the cord up against the metal clip which creates a loop at the end of the steering line, and then tied the other end of the cord to an H-bar. This made it easy for me to locate and grab the rear steering line after I had replaced the steering mechanism and was ready to attach the steering lines to the rivet on the steering arm.


Last edited by pmmpete on Sat Aug 13, 2022 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:37 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:07 pm
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Good write up, glad we were able to get it working for you. This type of thing is always hard remotely!

Kevin


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 4:24 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:48 pm
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Location: Missoula, Montana
kredden wrote:
Good write up, glad we were able to get it working for you. This type of thing is always hard remotely!

Kevin

Your advice was invaluable, Kevin, and you always responded immediately to my questions. Thanks! You and your Hobie dealership provided great service!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2022 12:23 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:48 pm
Posts: 278
Location: Missoula, Montana
Yesterday when I reached my launch site at the end of another day of fishing from my 12' PA 360 I tried to pull out my drive, but it wouldn't come out. When confirming that the spindle was lined up with the drive hole, I realized that the problem was that the rear bolt which holds the 360 steering mechanism's clutch in place had backed out so far that it was hooking on the drive, and was preventing me from removing the drive from the drive hole. I had a 5/16th hex wrench with me for adjusting the tension on the belt, but couldn't reach the bolt to run it in. Finally I was able to twist the drive out from under the protruding bolt and pull out my drive so I could land.

The clutch is the device which is located on top of the small gear on the left side of the drive hole which engages the large gear in the 360 drive. The rear bolt which holds the clutch in place is used to adjust how hard the small gear in the drive hole pushes against the large gear in the 360 drive. The Hobie video with instructions for replacing the 360 steering mechanism (https://www.youtube.com/embed/UTWFxWeBi ... =light&amp at 23:50-24:55 and 25:53-29:42) specifies that you should tighten the rear bolt, and then back the bolt off 2 or 3 turns until the drive drops in place easily. Because the rear bolt isn't tightened, the video says to put blue or red Loctite or similar thread locker on the rear bolt. In the video, the technician uses a small amount of red Loctite. When I installed my new steering mechanism, I was nervous about using red Permatex Threadlocker, because the instructions on the package said "Threadlocker is for use on metal parts and is not to be used on plastics. For Red Threadlocker, cured product must be heated to 500 degrees F (260 degrees C) before parts will separate." But because the technician in the video used red Loctite, I used the same amount of red Permatex Threadlocker as he used in the video. But that amount didn't keep the bolt from backing out.

So at home I took the bolt out, put a generous amount of blue threadlocker on the threads, ran the bolt all the way in, backed it out two turns, and then adjusted it further until my drive dropped in easily. I hope that this works. I'm going to keep my eye on the rear bolt, and will continue to carry a 5/16 hex wrench so I can run it back in if it starts backing out again.


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