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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2016 5:55 pm 
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jda44120 wrote:
I have a 2011 Mirage Outback that I've used 2-4 weeks each summer on a lake in NH. This summer the boat started leaking and fills up with water over 12 hours. Although outside the 2 yr warranty, I learned that drive well leaks are caused by a Hobie manufacturing process problem (the Hobie part manager said so on the Hobie user forum) and Hobie would provide some price relief on a replacement hull. When I contacted Hobie's warranty manager (Jerry) he insisted I open a 'warranty claim' through the dealer and provide a photo. I did and he responded saying the picture didn't show a crack and that I'd have to drive the boat to the dealer to verify the problem. I explained it was a 3 hour round trip to the dealer and there was no visible crack. There must be a leak beneath the drive assembly where it attaches to the hull. The dealer would have to place the boat in the water overnight to verify the problem. Still Jerry wouldn't budge. So for the sake of a hull that can't cost Hobie more than $500 (and I would have gladly paid this!), Jerry has alienated a previously loyal and enthusiastic Hobie customer. Too bad because I love the boat when it doesn't leak. Are there any alternatives out there?


You would still have to take the boat back to a dealer to verify a fault, like any product. They can spot a crack by methods other than sitting in water. eg Pressure testing and squirting with soapy water. You can do this yourself with reversing a vacuum cleaner into drain hole. Shining a light inside at night would help show a crack. Minor cracks may not be obvious until under pressure by pedaling.

A 3 hour round trip is not too far to replace an out of warranty product, and I think you are being harsh on a manufacturer who is within their rights to not offer anything and say tough luck

Problem with leaks is it is too easy to make assumptions. Not all leaks are manufacturing problems. Hammering my first mirage into too many mud banks and submerged logs probably had more to do with its failure than weak design alone.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:54 pm 
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I went outside in the perfect lighting and finally got a good picture of the crack. This is from the inside of the hull. Thanks for all the responses. All 3 links are the same pic. I just wanted to make sure one worked. http://imgur.com/dltRQC1 http://i.imgur.com/dltRQC1.jpg Image


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2016 10:53 pm 
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Location: Charlevoix, MI
That is the exact same spot where my leak was. Mine was caused by a misalignment of the MD in the well. It leaked a few drops of water on each pedal stroke but then closed up on coasting. If you have a videocamera, this can be nicely demonstrated on the water by aiming the camera at that spot while pedaling and while resting.

Put the PA on sawhorses, insert your MD and examine where the drive contacts the hull on each pedal stroke. In my case, each pedal stroke caused the drive to rock backward slightly, putting pressure on that cracked spot. And the nose tab of the MD never touched the front "shelf" in the drive well where it is supposed to rest.

To repair I needed to first correct the misalignment. I had to build up that front shelf about 5mm using a button I made from 2 fused layers of scrap PE hull material that my dealer provided. With that shim in place, there is no way for the back of the MD to contact the hull near that crack. Only then is it safe to repair the crack itself. It can probably be sealed watertight by plastic welding and then structurally reinforced using 3M Scotch-Weld DP 8010.

Good luck.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 8:30 am 
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jda44120 wrote:
I have a 2011 Mirage Outback that I've used 2-4 weeks each summer on a lake in NH. This summer the boat started leaking and fills up with water over 12 hours. Although outside the 2 yr warranty, I learned that drive well leaks are caused by a Hobie manufacturing process problem (the Hobie part manager said so on the Hobie user forum) and Hobie would provide some price relief on a replacement hull. When I contacted Hobie's warranty manager (Jerry) he insisted I open a 'warranty claim' through the dealer and provide a photo. I did and he responded saying the picture didn't show a crack and that I'd have to drive the boat to the dealer to verify the problem. I explained it was a 3 hour round trip to the dealer and there was no visible crack. There must be a leak beneath the drive assembly where it attaches to the hull. The dealer would have to place the boat in the water overnight to verify the problem. Still Jerry wouldn't budge. So for the sake of a hull that can't cost Hobie more than $500 (and I would have gladly paid this!), Jerry has alienated a previously loyal and enthusiastic Hobie customer. Too bad because I love the boat when it doesn't leak. Are there any alternatives out there?


That sounds atypical of the drive well issues we have had and discussed in these forums. Those well problems you are quoting were primarily from 2006 or so vintage as well. 2011 hulls have had very little problem with this issue.

If there is no visible crack it should take pedaling pressure to open and leak. Since this happens "over night" is it possible this is a leaky hatch or leaky scupper or other issue? I would suggest doing the soapy water bubble test to determine where there may be a leak.

In any case, we would not issue a replacement hull via warranty without dealer inspection. Cerytainly validation that there is an issue that can not be fixed. They would also take possession of the hull to disable it from further use when we replace it. So somehow or other a dealer has to have the hull in hand.

There are options for repair or replacement, but you still need to be sure what the problem actually is.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 8:40 am 
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Toddj3000 wrote:
I went outside in the perfect lighting and finally got a good picture of the crack. This is from the inside of the hull. Thanks for all the responses. All 3 links are the same pic. I just wanted to make sure one worked. http://imgur.com/dltRQC1 http://i.imgur.com/dltRQC1.jpg Image


Great photo and certainly enough to use in a claim if you want to go that route. Have you contacted a dealer? and... what is the vintage?

It is repairable.

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Hobie Cat USA


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:11 am 
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Thanks for the response, I have not contacted a dealer yet. The kayak is a 2010. Does anyone have any idea what a replacement hull would cost in my situation. Thanks in advance for any responses.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:18 am 
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You would have to make the claim. Warranty has a prorated cost based on age and ownership.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 11:27 pm 
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I had same problem. I used marine goop i think, the uv resistant kind in clear. Never had problem again


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 9:35 pm 
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Thanks for the advice Jude. That's definitely the cheapest option so far. I made a claim with my Hobie dealer who contacted Hobie head quarters. They told me that I could try to fix it, and included a video link. The email said that if the repair technique in the video didn't fix the problem, I could purchase a new PA14 for 15% off. So about $3220 after tax. I asked if they could replace only the hull. They said no. I'm definitely going to try to fix it. 15% off of $3450 is pretty lame. I realize that Hobie strictly regulates their prices but 15% off an entire new kayak just seems arrogant.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:14 pm 
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Having read all these posts I am having second thoughts about buying a new 2017 PA 14. I know to some $3450 is chump change but to me that's a lot of cash, which I have been saving for the PA14. Id hate to spend that kind of money, only to run into these issues in 3-4 years where I have to pretty much buy another one (at 15% discount) or attempt fix after fix that wont work.

What is the Hobie PA14 warranty length? What does it cover?

FB


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:24 pm 
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This is covered. The warranty is 2 years, but as mentioned many times, simply make a claim and we look at it.

This problem is from a small batch of boats with a loose fit of the drive which allowed the drive to press against the aft wall. This could have been corrected before damage occurred.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:31 pm 
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I don't understand how I was supposed to know this was going to happen. My kayak worked perfectly. Then one day it was taking on water. I made sure the mirage drive was securely locked in place before each use. I was careful to always avoid obstacles with the fins. I basically treated it like a $3500 kayak. I guess I only get 15% off of an entire kayak now because I could not foresee the future. I haven't taken my PA14 out in a while. I've been using my Feelfree Corona with a Jackson seat upgrade. I get a sick feeling whenever I think about constantly scooping water out of my PA14, which costs over 3 times as much as the Feelfree. I still plan on getting it repaired or doing it myself. However, my next trip is to the ocean. I do not feel comfortable taking a repaired kayak out into the ocean, when I've had so many people tell me that permanently repairing a crack in the mirage drive area is impossible. I understand that my kayak is well beyond the 2 year warranty and, therefore, I don't have much of a leg to stand on. Hobie could have simply told me tough luck, but they didn't. I guess after reading all the other cases like mine I thought I'd at least qualify for a decently discounted hull replacement. Thank you, to anyone who actually read all this.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:52 am 
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Toddj3000 wrote:
I don't understand how I was supposed to know this was going to happen. My kayak worked perfectly. Then one day it was taking on water. I made sure the mirage drive was securely locked in place before each use. I was careful to always avoid obstacles with the fins. I basically treated it like a $3500 kayak. I guess I only get 15% off of an entire kayak now because I could not foresee the future. I haven't taken my PA14 out in a while. I've been using my Feelfree Corona with a Jackson seat upgrade. I get a sick feeling whenever I think about constantly scooping water out of my PA14, which costs over 3 times as much as the Feelfree. I still plan on getting it repaired or doing it myself. However, my next trip is to the ocean. I do not feel comfortable taking a repaired kayak out into the ocean, when I've had so many people tell me that permanently repairing a crack in the mirage drive area is impossible. I understand that my kayak is well beyond the 2 year warranty and, therefore, I don't have much of a leg to stand on. Hobie could have simply told me tough luck, but they didn't. I guess after reading all the other cases like mine I thought I'd at least qualify for a decently discounted hull replacement. Thank you, to anyone who actually read all this.



Sorry this is happening to you bro. I guess thats one of the advantages of going with a less expensive, quality kayak....if anything happens, youre only out a few hundred bucks. The thing is, those cheap little kayaks are built like tanks, they generally will last a long long time.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 1:59 pm 
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https://www.amazon.com/3M-Scotch-Weld-S ... rds=dp8010


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 7:10 am 
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Location: Pula - Sardinia
Hi. For the ones who used dp-8010 can you confirm that in order to use it you need to buy so add o the tools and in this way the cost becomes similar of that for the Hobie KC welder?


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