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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:46 pm 
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Location: sacramento ca
hi all- i'm looking at buying an h18 and it has coleman hulls and a comptip mast.

i would like to know if there are any advantages or disadvantages to these features.
i own an older h18 and want to upgrade to a bit nicer boat.
the owner says the hulls are lighter weight and in really good shape.

any advice appreciated

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peter myers
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 1:07 pm 
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If built after 1984... could be lighter weight. The weight of the 18 was reduced in 1984 as was the crossbar connection strength. The boat varied in weight and strength until about 1989.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 1:14 pm 
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Location: sacramento ca
thanks matt- if its nice i'll probably buy it. i think he said its a 1988

what about the comptip masts?
any practical issues with them? i will have the option of swapping out
with a regular mast from my other boat.

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peter myers
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:08 pm 
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All Hobie Cats have had CompTip (Non-Conductive safety feature to help avoid fatal shock from overhead powerlines) mast since the mid 80's. This is a very important feature. Keep the newer mast. This also makes the boat "Class Legal" to race in Hobie Class Association events. This might not be important to you, but could increase the resale value when you go to sell it someday.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 5:24 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2007 5:40 am
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Location: Metuchen NJ
My H18 is of 1988 vintage. It is outstanding condition. Bought it new, sold it in '95, bought it back in '07. There is only one semi-soft spot on the deck of the port hull directly in front of the rear crossbar. This is a common spot from the other skipper landing too hard on the hull when sitting down. That'll get fixed this spring.

But structurally, the construction for that year, at least for my boat, was very good. I'm not even sure if it is a Coleman hull or not.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:45 am 
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Location: Detroit, MI
OlderBowman wrote:
My H18 is of 1988 vintage. It is outstanding condition. Bought it new, sold it in '95, bought it back in '07. There is only one semi-soft spot on the deck of the port hull directly in front of the rear crossbar. This is a common spot from the other skipper landing too hard on the hull when sitting down. That'll get fixed this spring.

But structurally, the construction for that year, at least for my boat, was very good. I'm not even sure if it is a Coleman hull or not.


There's no such thing as "Coleman" hulls.

Coleman Co. owned Hobie Cat from 1976 - 1988.

Hull graphics were changed in 1983 to replace the white outlined "Hobie Cat" just forward of the transom to a black "Hobie Cat" with a much smaller "a Coleman Company" tag line underneath it. Nothing changed in the construction of the hulls, other than the weight reductions Matt M. mentioned above.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 8:54 am 
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Location: sacramento ca
so if it is a red line hull does that mean it is lighter weight?
i'd really like a primer on what to look for to determine if its a good boat

thx

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 9:00 am 
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Location: Detroit, MI
petermyers wrote:
so if it is a red line hull does that mean it is lighter weight?
i'd really like a primer on what to look for to determine if its a good boat

thx


A red glue seam ("red line") on the hull / deck joint is an indicator of the lighter construction method used in 1984 - 1985 model year boats.

However, a boat can pick up a lot of weight in 25 years. The red glue seam does not guarantee that the boat is still lighter.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 9:50 am 
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Matt, what about the delamination issues that started around '84. I always thought the delam came about due to ownership change and design/build change. I have seen several of the boats that delamed. Hobie replaced a bunch of hulls '84-'87 under warranty as I understand. One of my sailing buddies bought an '84 Magnum and it delaminated in the first season. I currently have a "84 redline 18 that is solid, really solid. What is the story on the delamination problems?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:09 am 
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ncmbm wrote:
Matt, what about the delamination issues that started around '84. I always thought the delam came about due to ownership change and design/build change. I have seen several of the boats that delamed. Hobie replaced a bunch of hulls '84-'87 under warranty as I understand. One of my sailing buddies bought an '84 Magnum and it delaminated in the first season. I currently have a "84 redline 18 that is solid, really solid. What is the story on the delamination problems?


Whatever construction changes occurred in 1984 were not the result of a change in ownership. Might have been that Coleman got more involved in the running of Hobie Cat and were trying to reduce costs. That's about the time that things started to go downhill for Hobie Cat as a company.

Certainly, making the boats lighter used less resin = less $, however, the changes in production methods (vacuum-bagging) may have actually increased the costs.

Delamination problems can occur due to a wide variety of reasons - bad foam, poor construction technique, dry layups. Matt M. would probably have more insight on that.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:48 am 
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Issues with 84-87 H18 hulls was not delamination. It was primarily cracking at the crossbar connections. This was mostly due to a reduction in the glass patch at the crossbar area... inside the hull. Along with other things done, the width and weight of the patch was reduced in to lighten the boat. This was a period of adjustments to compete with Prindle / Nacra I understand. The addition of wings at the same time over stressed the crossbar connections... the wings were the primary cause of failures, but cracks occurred in non-wing H18s as well. We added a set of stainless plates in about 85-86 and finally cured it with a big glass patch in 1988-89 construction.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 9:18 pm 
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Location: sacramento ca
nice info- but really off topic from my post and questions.

i'd really like a check list of what to look for so i know i'm buying a good boat.
btw- how do i tell what year the boat is?

thanks

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peter myers
916 955-1148
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:11 am 
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Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 7:49 am
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Location: North Carolina
Check wear on the keels, put your hands on every section of the hulls and press looking for soft spots and listening for any cracking sounds, check all aluminum for pitting and corrosion, check sterns for cracking, check dagger wells for wear and cracking, check sails for crispness and wear, check rigging and lines for wear and corrosion, check condition of tramp. Everything should be in usable condition, hulls must be solid, crossbars cannot be cracked, rivets should be secure. Check out everything, ask questions, be ready to negotiate, good luck!


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:33 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:38 pm
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Location: Roswell, GA - USA
petermyers wrote:
nice info- but really off topic from my post and questions.

i'd really like a check list of what to look for so i know i'm buying a good boat.
btw- how do i tell what year the boat is?

thanks


To identify the year of the boat use the serial number and interpret the code using the info on the following link

http://www.hobiecat.com/support/index-sail.html

I recently bought a 1983 Hobie 18 that was listed as an early 90's boat but the serial number said otherwise.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 9:32 am 
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Location: Jersey Shore
In addition to doing all the standard checks when buying a used boat (soft spots, wear corrosion, etc), you need to check the crossbar connection points on a mid-80's "red glue" boat (which would have been built duing the Coleman period).

First off, the front crossbars and shrouds should have the upgraded anchor brackets installed. These will have four bolts that pass through the side of the hull. They are located on both inboard and outboard crossbar connections.

Second, you need to physically look up under the lip at these connection points. It is fairly common for the gelcoat to occasionally have hairline cracks in this area, but any cracks through the fiberglass are not OK. Cracks through the glass in this area are a sign that the boat has been over stressed / under-built and will need major repair work.

sm


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