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 Post subject: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:02 am 
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Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:40 am
Posts: 29
Location: Belgium (Flanders)
Hello,

Our Oasis 2010, ivory dune, arrived a couple of hours ago.
Everything looks ok , the color has class :)
A testrun isn't possible, it's a bit to cold in Flanders, we'll have to wait for better weather.
But something is puzzling me..... do the 2010 models come with a "sail rudder"??
It has a height of 36cm, is that the size of the large rudder?

So if we have got a sail rudder on our Oasis, then:
Or, Hobie was temporarely out of standard rudders when they assembled our Oasis (thanks Hobie)
Or, Roadrunners wish to make the large rudder the standard rudder has come through (thanks Roadrunner and Hobie) :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:05 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 15089
Location: Oceanside, California
Yes, Oversized rudder is now standard on the Oasis.

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Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
Posts: 3017
Location: Escondido
My pleasure! :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:20 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:50 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Big Bear Lake&Claremont CA
Will it also be standard equipment on the Outfitter.

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Fastfish/Geoff
Kayaks Owned>Outback/Mine & Revolution/Wife


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:02 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 15089
Location: Oceanside, California
Not shown on the Outfitter as standard. The Oasis has a revised bottom that lifted the transom and rudder. The hull also tracks really well, so it works better with the larger rudder. The Outfitter works fine with the standard one.

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Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 5:54 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:49 pm
Posts: 7
Location: Manitoba CANADA
Matt - I can't believe that you've stated that the Outfitter doesn't require the larger rudder and tracks well with the standard one. The boat with extra passenger weight definitely overpowers the standard small rudder. With the standard rudder you are forced to "correct" tracking every 30 seconds. The larger sail rudder completely eliminates this annoyance. With it, the boat tracks like a knife.

A few ounces of plastic in this case, makes an ergonomic world of difference. You would be making your client base so much more happy and content. I am sure other owners would chime and say the same: the Outfitter (like the Oasis) should be fitted with the larger sail rudder from the get go.

Jeep


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 6:04 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
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Location: Oceanside, California
Thats a sales department decision... I was just reporting the standard feature and engineers opinion of the Outfitter steering. Roadrunner? You have experience with this one too?

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Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:00 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:46 pm
Posts: 3017
Location: Escondido
From a designer's perspective, there is an axiom with rudders -- use the least amount of rudder to do the job. The principle behind this is that excess rudder surface creates unnecessary drag. Hobie apparently subscribes to this idea. The small Hobie rudder in most cases, is adequate to control the boat, and actually turns the boat better than most other kayak rudders (which are largely even smaller). But then, most paddling kayaks have the paddle available to readily assist the rudder when necessary.

When the Oasis got its new bottom, it lost some rocker (and therefore some turning ability) and gained 100lb. capacity, so the boat doesn't settle in the water as much as with the older Oasis. In other words it lost some of its steering capability (especially on swells). In this picture, you can see how much of the small rudder is now out of the water from it's high mounting position (new Oasis on left, old on right):
Image
Thus the desirability for the deeper reaching large rudder.

I have not operated an Outfitter or the Outback with the large rudder, but my experience with large rudders on the Adventure, Oasis, Revolution, Sport, i-9s and i-12s are very similar to jeep's description. Certainly some of the Hobie line needs a large rudder more than others, but I believe they all benefit greatly. It's like getting performance tires and shocks on your car -- the handling improves significantly. The slower the speed the greater the difference in authority, right down to 0 MPH with the large rudder. The higher the speed, the more stable the tracking and with fewer adjustments with the large rudder. I've noticed this to be universal with the different kayaks. Additionally, for both tandems and inflatables, the turning moment is slower because of the greater weight and/or windage factor, and the large rudder compensates for this to some degree.

The first thing all my Hobies get is a new large rudder. With all respect to the designers, the benefits of the large rudder outweigh any friction losses. In fact, I was in a race a couple of years ago against a much superior athlete (identical boat models). Luckily, I had two advantages -- Turbofins and a large rudder. If he had either one, no doubt he would have won easily. I spent a good part of the race looking at the back of his head (and boat) and noticed his boat wiggling as it wormed its way through the swells, his rudder in constant motion, slowing him down fractionally with each adjustment.
Image
My large rudder kept me on a straighter track. Fortunately he doesn't follow the forums often (and I keep "forgetting" to divulge this to him) so there is an excellent chance he'll keep using the small rudder (heh heh)!

I am totally spoiled by large rudders and consider it a severe handicap not to have them on my boats. Just as most cars don't come standard with Bilstein shocks, most Hobie don't come standard with large rudders. But at least they make it economical to make the upgrade. IMO, it's the best $23 accessory Hobie offers. 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Oasis 2010 rudder
PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 10:00 am 
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 12:44 pm
Posts: 15089
Location: Oceanside, California
Since the change to the "T" handle up/down rope-pull system for the rudder... it is much easier to deploy and retract the larger rudder. This was a problem on the old lever style up/down. I will certainly put that idea on the table. I am not sure of the production issues on this though. The large rudder is a separate mold I believe and would be additional cost in the boat.

_________________
Matt Miller
Former - Director of Parts and Accessory Sales
Warranty and Technical Support
Hobie Cat USA
(Retired 11/7/2022)


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