How to fun race 18 vs 17?

Can't wait to get my 2 new-to-me Hobies out there in a couple months. All fixed up and ready. I have a bunch of friends who hang with me doing various summer beach things and this season I've got a 17 and an 18 to play with. Question is how to have a fun race with these two boats with novice pilots. I plan to race around islands, bouys, etc back to the tiki bar on the beach. The 17 has no jib, the 18 no wings. I've seen ratings that say start a certain amount of seconds behind for each 30 min of race time, but we have no idea of race time to get around an island maybe 3 miles away. I guess we could compute that. How bout some other creative ways: we could also throw another person on the 18, not use the 18 jib etc. Any ideas? Maybe its just a trial and error situation.

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H18, H17 & Various motor boats

I race both the 17 & 18. I've sailed in regattas where 18's & 17's have been lumped together at the start or are otherwise on the same course. In my opinion, the two boats are extremely close in speed around a standard windward/leeward or triangle course (with two people on the 18 and one on the 17). Optimally, each boat sails at slightly different headings around the course, but both boats often tend to end up at the marks at pretty much the same time when sailed equally. The 17 will point a little higher upwind and a little lower downwind compared to the 18. Also, the 17 generally seems to go upwind a little faster than the 18, but the 18 makes up ground downwind (thanks to the jib).

For the type of racing you're talking about doing, it's going to come down to whoever is the better sailor. I'd sail each boat exactly as it was designed to be sailed and start everyone at the same time.

sm

THATS what I wanted to know!

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H18, H17 & Various motor boats

In light air, often times the 17 will beat the 18 because it is quite a bit lighter, especially if you are sailing the 18 "2 up".

In medium to heavy air, while they sail different angles, the boats sail close enough to the same speed that usually the better skipper wins.

If you are going to be racing in an open regatta take the H-17, its PHRF number is an absolute gift.

In most conditions, until you get pretty good, it is very difficult to sail a H-18 to its PHRF rating.

Stephen

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If the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, maybe it is time to water your own lawn.

Just to play devil's advocate, I would argue that in light wind, the 18 has an advantage in that it's jib makes it easier to find and stay in the groove. The jib also makes tacking in light wind easier (or at least more consistent). One blown tack and you will lose a ton of ground. Of course, this is comming from a 200+ pound skipper. A minimum weight skipper on a 17 in light wind will smoke just about anyone, especially if there's chop.

In any case, they're all pretty darn close in speed, and for fun racing, I'd do just that -> have fun!

sm

Based on observation, given skippers of equal competence, 8 times out of 10 the 17 comes out on top (Gawd, I hate to admit that in a public forum!)

In 8 knots & less its pretty much a draw. The 18 with 300# on it tacks like a barge in very light wind.
While, I have seen more inexperienced 17 skippers get into trouble trying to tack in heavy winds.

100% agree on that one.

Well said, good input, I wholeheartedly agree !

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If the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, maybe it is time to water your own lawn.

No matter how good you are it will never sail to that number.