Return to Hobie.com
Hobie Forums
It is currently Wed Sep 10, 2025 6:43 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:34 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:50 pm
Posts: 8
We need some help tacking in higher winds ...upto 15 knots & flatish water we can tack great time after time, smooth with very little loss of speed ...however as soon as wind and swell/wid chop picks up we strugle to get thru the turn and either stall or stop before moving off again...

It feels like a steering problem as the extra speed going into the turn sometimes feels like we are coming to a sudden stop.. like a handbrake turn in a car...

Any tips for heavier weather tacking?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:55 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:56 pm
Posts: 740
Location: Los Angeles
Having learned to sail in the Pacific Ocean off the coats of Long Beach, California next to Hurricane Gulch (I wonder why they named it that), high winds and swells are all I know. I probably wouldn’t know how to sail in flat water and low winds here are booooooooooring to me. At one point, it would take me sometimes 20 minutes to tack successfully, if I didn’t capsize first. Then I started studying the anatomy of the tack, particularly involving the H16. The hull shape of the H16 is one of the primary reasons they’re more difficult to tack than other cats. Cats that have hulls with round bottoms are a lot easier to tack. The hull shape of the H16 is like one long dagger/center board.

It’s difficult to say what I did exactly that made tacking my H16 just part of sailing. First, I converted my standard jib halyard to an Aussie halyard. This prevented directional mast compression allowing symmetrical mast rotation while tacking to either side.

The second was mast rake. This allowed me to sail closer to the wind so that the distance from close hauled to head-to-wind is not as great.

The third was to learn (and it took practice) to get the timing right in releasing the main sheet after bringing the boat to head –to-wind by sheeting it in. With the wind blowing harder, this transition happens much quicker and your timing is much more of an issue. If you reach head-to-wind with your main sheeted in, you can forget about making the tack. You will not complete your tack as the main being sheeted in gives your boat the weather vane effect and you will surely end up in irons. You also have to remember that once you start to turn the rudder (remembering not to turn it more that 45 degrees) it should remained turned until the boat goes through the eye of the wind. Make the turn smoothly and do not allow the rudders to straighten until the boat has changed sides. I will usually remain on the windward side of the boat until the boat goes through the eye of the wind. This gives me more control of the rudder during this process. .

Roll tacking – It would be so much easier to tack the boat if you could get one of the bows out of the water. Roll tacking just might be your answer. While executing the tacking process, move to the rear of the boat and have your crew move right next to you. How close they come depends on their weight. You wouldn’t want a 250lb crew sitting on the back of your boat with you (especially if you too weigh 250lbs) unless you want your boat to turn over. H16s are crew displacement sensitive. I have to relearn how to sail my boat every time I sail with a different crew if there’s a big difference in weight. Anyway, this will bring the leeward bow out of the water leaving only one hull to turn in the water. As soon as the boat changes sides, (and not before) instruct your crew to go to the new side to prepare to bring the jib to the new side. Make sure that they don’t go too late either because you’ll still be on the old side going through the process of bringing the tiller to the other side. Also, if you’re sailing in swells and you see one coming, wait until your boat is on top of the swell before beginning your tack. This will also aid in the removal of the bows from the water during the tacking process.

I made these changes and modifications in my sailing technique all in the same week so it would be difficult to say which part of what I did made the biggest difference. All I can say is that I now have no problems with tacking, unless I’m trying to break in a new crew. I have typically sailed solo in the past but it looks as though I have finally found a crew that’s going to work out. :D These have been my experiences. Hope this helps.

_________________
Image
Happy Sailing,

David


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:44 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:50 pm
Posts: 8
Thanks David lots of food for thought !


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: tacking
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 2:04 pm 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:11 pm
Posts: 313
Location: West Point, Utah
When it gets really ugly and you are on the verge of survival sailing, it is sometimes better to jibe. If it is critical that you change directions and need to be sure that it will happen, a quick jibe is a pretty sure thing. Better make it quick though, and be ready to control the boom coming over or it could be a disaster.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 6:48 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 1:20 pm
Posts: 122
Location: Atlanta, GA
It sounds like you're losing power through your rudders. Do you have a lot of lee helm? Check your rudder rake and make sure everythings ok because if they're off they can cause you to lose just about all your power and momentum through the turn...resulting in exactly what you're describing. I had this same problem with a rental 16 once, it wouldn't tack cause the rudders were so cocked up which resulted in me having to do 270 degree jibes to accomplish what a simple tack would have done. Also.. I doubt this is the problem but could help a lot if it is... but make sure the crews not popping the jib too early. As far as weight displacement goes, unless you're gonna try and roll tack the 16 I would just be careful to keep the crew somewhat forward so you're not bogging down the stern.
Plus.. a GREAT way to flip the 16 over backwards is to tack in high winds + swells with your weight back

_________________
Tiger 947/2364


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 7:57 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Deck Hand

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:50 pm
Posts: 8
No lee helm and rudders are tucked under transom as reccomended in all the guides... I think it is more likely just my poor control on tiller..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 2:00 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Captain

Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 10:19 am
Posts: 72
Location: Gisborne, New Zealand
No one has mentioned the gib much here. I find it critical in tacking. Let the main sheet out as you head up to wind (as already discussed in this subject). Leave the gib where it is set until both the gib and the main have filled on the opposite tack. The gib will fill first and the mainsail soon after. As soon as the mainsail is filled on the new tack let out the gib and pull it is fast on the new leeward side. As the boat starts to accelerate pull in the main sheet and off you go.
I had problems tacking early on until I learned I was letting the gib out before both sails had filled and also failing to let out the main sheet a couple of feet. The gib is very important in pushing the bows through the wind and on to the new course. Last thing to remember is have enough speed before attempting a tack.
Doing all three things will make tacking pretty easy.

_________________
Anthony
88 H16 "Moonshine"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:13 am 
Offline
Site Rank - Old Salt

Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2005 9:47 pm
Posts: 614
Location: San Diego
OK,

First, to tack, there are three different things happening: sails, weight, and rudders.

Sheet in the main as you turn the boat towards head to wind. Smooth. Don't slam the rudders over as this will stop the boat and not too slow as the boat will slow too much before the boat is head to wind and the rudders will not work. Sheeting in will act to weather vane the boat head to wind. If you sheet out too soon, it is like throwing on the brakes. As soon as the jib backwinds, sheet the main sail out. If the main is sheeted at this point it will keep the boat from pivoting off the wind, or you will capsize. Keep the rudders turned as you throw the tiller and scramble to the new side. Sheet in the main sail and when the battens pop, change the jib to the new tack.

Weight placement will help to turn the boat. If you are on the back windward corner, the bows are up and the boat will turn/pivot more easily, but in wind and chop you may capsize backwards if the wind gets under the tramp and the bow is up on the top of a wave so use caution. The backwinding jib can capsize the boat alone. A fast crew can help to get weight on the windward side forward to limit this type of capsize, but forward weight also makes the boat harder to steer, so time on the boat and practice will make it all happen better. In a big blow, easing the backwinding jib may be required.

When you turn is also important. If you can time the tack on a swell or steep chop to get the bows up at the top of the wave as the boat hits head to wind and the jib backwinds, the bows will be up and the boat will complete the tack more quickly.

Speed into the tack is important too, so starting the tack from the wire with all the above happening will also help, but if you are not fast, once again, you will capsize so use caution.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
© Hobie Cat Company. All rights reserved.
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group