Absolutely don't want to go out on it again.

I would add one more thing...windsurfing and beach cat sailing have a lot in common. I worked in a windsurfing shop for several years and the people that needed to be "convinced" that they should windsurf were virtually never successful. These sports take a long time and a lot of mistakes to learn. If cat sailing is something that truely interests you, then stick with it and make your mistakes, but make them in a safe manner (don't sail in offshore winds on Great Lakes for starters).

If it's something that you need to be convinced that you should be doing, then save yourself a lot of hassle and move to a different activity. Obviously most of the people here are die hard sailors, so you're not going to get many negative opinions about sailing on this board.

sm

This is what I read in your post, you knew you were not acting correctly and are disappointed you had a 'miserable experience'.

"as much as I KNEW the rules of turning the mast to the wind we tried the other way."


"I understand that we were wrong in the righting procedure. But that doesn't change the fact that it turned out to be a miserable experience for everyone."


You can ride a bike seated backwards and have a miserable day too..but would you? Don't answer that.

I had to try!!

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Bodhisatfa

I share this opinion. I started sailing this year. A couple of hours on the beach, and a couple more on the boat with a couple of experienced locals probably saved me a year of hard knocks learning experiences. We sail on a small body of water, generally referred to as "the pond". There are always some fishermen and pontooners out, not to mention usually a few Hobie guys. It is a safe environment. You need a safe environement so that you can get use to all the stuff that can and will go wrong, get comfortable with all the ways the boat will flip, tip and stuff a hull, and how to right it.

In my opinion, you simply cannot go out into Huron without help and being afraid of the boat. Work on those and I believe that you will find that the boat is a blast.

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Russ

Sorry you had such an awful time. I'm not familiar with the conditions on Huron since I live in Florida. If you really want to sail hobies I agree that you should find an experienced hobie sailor to go sailing with a time or 2.

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Big Dan
1982 H16

Hot Flash #68984

Wow.wow.wow. a lot of very good advice. The Hobie is at my cottage on Lake huron. Very unlikely that I will be towing it any where. So onshore, light winds for this self proclaimed whimp. I'm sure i'll have enough fun, as limiting as it may seem to serious, experienced members of this forum.
So do I push the tiller stick to turn the boat into the wind if I feel un-easy with the speed? Along with uncleating the sheets then which first, main or jib? Again, thank you.

Too bad you've only gotten replies from the die-hards. First things first: If you need to ask which to do first, you probably need some more time with an experienced sailor on board; cat sailor or not doesn't matter. My best friend has a "pilot's license", but the hairs on the back of his neck don't respond to a rising wind, so he's utterly worthless (except for being able to rent us a large boat in the great lakes) as a teacher, or as an actual sailor, for that matter. If it ain't in a book he's read, he doesn't understand it or have a clue how to respond to whatever "it" is. I love him dearly, but the truth is the truth.

Sailing any cat always looks like fun, but if you have little or no prior sailing experience, and are more like my friend than me, actually sailing a cat may be biting off more than you're personally capable of handling at this point. And by that I sincerely mean no offense.

If you do have some sailing experience, the first thing I can tell you is that cats respond twice as fast as monohulls, so you need to react twice as fast, as well! ALWAYS LET GO (or put another way, push the controls away from you, which would be the tiller and mainsheet)! That means let both the main sheet and the tiller "go", and I'm assuming you have the rudders tuned to a "weather helm". The jib sheet is inconsequential at this point, but ideally, if you have responsive crew, letting go of that helps, too, when things get really dicey.

Basically, you appear to know what slows you down, so don't sweat the order in which to do things. And don't be shy about doing them ALL at once. Maybe not so graceful, but it certainly beats the alternative (unless you're under 25). All things considered, when I feel a puff coming, I uncleat the mainsheet, and will let that go as needed first, followed by steering into the wind, if required.

Over time, many people have bought Hobie 16s because they've seen them on TV or whatever, and as fun and easy as they appear, they actually are not! Not without some experience with them, that is. I've sailed mine solo, with and without a dog, mainly with inexperienced crew, and actually taught myself most of what there is to know about a 16 without personal injury or putting anyone else at risk. At 61, I'm about ready to hang it up and go for a Getaway, assuming I still want to sail here in the U.S. But don't let anyone suggest to you that sailing a Hobie Cat is "easy as pie". Most anyone over 50 who owns a Hobie 16 today bought theirs from someone like you: Looked good, especially in the videos and brochures but couldn't keep it upright. It's only too bad they wait until all the parts have rotted. Or, it's too bad only old farts like me have any interest in sailing cats anymore.

There's no shame in deciding you've gone in over your head. I'm not pounding my chest like Tarzan, but some people are meant to sail cats, and some aren't. Myself, I still like the speed, but my crew and I don't trap out anymore - I just don't have the stamina to get things upright anymore. And these days, my wife and I get more cat sailing in two weeks in Belize than during an entire summer in Minnesota, so the fact you're still asking questions in late August is very impressive, I DO have to say.

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'83/'84 H16 "Cosmic Cat" Blue Hawaii #82278

Tell you what - I'll make you a good offer - I'll travel up from South Australia in the middle of your next summer and I'll teach you all I know - just give me bed & board.

Just be aware that though I'm small I'm a BIG eater! Maybe you could help with the airfare too?

I finish sailing here about May and would be glad to escape the southern winter in August.

Same goes for anyone else - maybe we could start a kind of 'exchange' thing happening here ?? I also give guitar lessons and tell stories and I really know how to cook spuds.

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Catamaran-Dogamaran on YouTube - starring Chloe the neigbour's dog
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1G9FpnTIOI

It really sounds like you had water in a hull. The second time I went out, I left the plugs out and in a very light wind (6-9 knots) couldn't keep it on it's feet. Eventually sailed to a dock where it promptly went tits up. This was the first sail with my wife on this boat.
It has now been 6 years and I will never again be without a Hobie. I have seen just about everything from losing a mast to the wind dying while 9 miles out in the bay (I had 2 paddles, but was solo). Hit by a thunder storm while trying to get into the marina (flipped 8 times and washed up on the causeway-boat and self survived). But in between these "adventures" I've also had some of the best sails ever. This season I have gone 21.6 mph solo in an 18 mph wind. What a thrill. I often go out after work to watch the sunset and sail into the marina in the twilight. I wouldn't give this up for anything. Is it always great -No. but I have found that it is worth it. Give it some effort and time and you will be well rewarded.

iclickjohn-

First and foremost, if this is something that really "stirs the soul" for you, then absolutely stick with it.

I won't bore you with my life story, but was at a similar stage 18 months ago as I was a total newbie to my H18. I had sailed a bit back in my college days (a bit over 20yrs ago), but I let life, kids, etc. get in the way. Since purchasing the boat, I decided to educate myself (reading lots and lots of books) as much as possible on everything from the basics to the finer points of catamaran sailing. What I have been able to accomplish in the last year was progress from barely being able to rig the boat, to racing with some experienced sailors in big wind/waves out on Lake Michigan, Saginaw bay, etc. <without> any swimming adventures.

The point is that these boats are not that hard to sail, and with a little-bit of patience and training you can get yourself to the point of feeling comfortable in conditions that would have made you pale a few months/years earlier. I still have a lot to learn and I make mistakes (going into irons at the start of the race on the wrong side of the committee boat while Mr. Bounds looked on ).

From a process standpoint, for me, I found that at first it required a lot of "thinking" while doing. This was a tough stage for me as it can be nerve-racking worrying about making a mistake, fumbling with the lines, etc. The thinking-while-doing process is inherently slow, and speed is of the essence when maneuvering a cat. However, lots of continued experience trains the brain and muscles to do things instinctively without thinking about it, allowing you to execute quickly. This allows the grey stuff between your ears the luxury of worrying about higher level things. For me, I can now feel the puff on my cheek, or notice the change in pitch of the boat long before it starts to fly a hull, and now automatically sheet out a bit or feather up into the wind. In the past, I had to think about it. Now that part is almost automatic and I can move on to more high-level things like race tactics, watching/planning for wind shifts, surfing waves the right way, etc.

What the other guys say about starting slowly is spot-on. You need a bit of a safety net at first. If you can't move the boat to an inland lake, then choose days where you have a good solid forecast and a mild on-shore breeze (onshore breeze should be less puffy). I would absolutely buy/bring a VHF radio in case something goes wrong (you can get portable waterproof units for less than $100). Perhaps having someone on shore with a radio is a good idea as well. Making sure someone in shore is watching or know when to expect you is important. Dress appropriately. Hypothermia is no fun.

Again, as long as its important to you, I'd encourage you to give it a go.

Cheers

(BTW, the CRAM group will be racing up at Tawas point state park this weekend if you want to stop by!)

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Jeff R
'88 H18 Jolly Mon
'10 F18 Closely Called
cramsailing.com

I am just down the river from you on Harsens Island in Lake St Clair, neighbor! I am just learning as well, and have been taking it out when I have a steady 5-7mph on shore breeze. It is amazing to me how fast these things go under gentle conditions. I haven't have the opportunity yet to get into bigger wind, but can't wait until i have the skill and courage to do it. So far, I haven't dumped it, and hope I don't for a while. They are pretty foregiving in gentle wind.

The first day I went out I just starting picking points I wanted to sail to and then went there and back. Picked another destination, there and back. I figured any idiot can sail away, getting back is the skill. Once I was confident I could go and come back, I started adding farther points that required a tack or two.

By the way, it is really blowing today!!

Just remember, it takes very little wind to learn to sail it. You will be surprised how well it goes in 3-5 wind.

Someone told me that learning to sail on an H-16 was like learning to drive in an Indy car. Things do go fast.

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Steve
2017 Hobie 16 "Cayman" sails 114795
1985 & 1973? Hobie 14 "Sea & Ski"

Awesome. I live in St Clair. LSC can whip up pretty good too. I've been out on little Muscamutte bay with speed boats.
My whole point of posting this was not in questioning whether I was making mistakes. But more the fact that it blew over so easy and in easy wind. I don't feel that I did anything wrong. We had just drained the hulls prior to going out so I wouldn't think that water could have got in that fast. Well. Maybe I will get an experienced friend to go out with me. At the very least to confirm or deny the boat has a problem. Or operator error
BTW, if you find my other post there is a good picture of my Hobie on my beach.
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=37395

Balance is everything on the Hobie, when I read you had your crew on the leeward side on the boat that sounded like trouble right away, especially if the wind was flaky! I try to keep as much wt. on the windward side of the boat as possible, even if it is listing sightly to windward. That way any gust that comes along you are prepared for it. Run the traveller out about 1/2 way that way if you have a higher chance of recovering from a big gust.

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06 getaway -- always remember, man with both feet in mouth have no leg to stand on.

Don't know if I can do that but this sounds like a promise I've made to myself many times. I learned to sail sailing solo. There have been many times that I've had to sail miles out into the Pacific attempting to tack many times before doing so successfully, enabling me to get back to land. I have said many times in the process, "if I ever get this boat back to land, I'm gonna get rid of it." Each time I played back in my mind the series of events that caused me the problem in the first place.

I had many books and videos but there's nothing like "time on the water !!!" As time went on, I began to understand the science (and/or art) of sailing more, remembering the conditions under which many of my mistakes were made and began to be a better sailor. Wait til you know what you're doing (at least partially) and if by then you feel like you "don't want to go out on it again" , then "be my guest !!!" Hobies (any catamaran) is not a Sunfish, Snark, or any other kind of mono-hull. It will be quicker and more responsive than any other mono-hull you've sailed. It will get away from you if you aren't familiar with it's habits. When you learn more about how to harness it's power, you'll be glad you kept it !!! That is, unless you were expecting to sip tea and eat scones while sailing it !!!

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Happy Sailing,

David