What do you think of this one? (wtb h16)

So I went today to check out a 16 today. The boat is an 84, I believe as determined by hull no. There are some inconsistancies though, i think, between the number and how the post on this sight says to interpret them. The number ends with M84K, for example. Isn't the m's slot supposed to be the month? M would be the 13th month though. And isn't the K supposed to relate to the build year vs. model year? Shouldn't it be a number then?

Anyway, the boat hulls seem stiff. They are incredibly dirty but it seems like much of the shine could be brought back out of the gelcoat, perhaps thanks to the uv inhibiting layer of dirt. I checked the tramp upright/hull unions and they seem watertight and stiff. All the running rigging though looks like it will need to be replaced as it is all black, moldy, and looks compromised by rot. The railrug is all but shot too. The rudders are plastic, but seem to be in okay condition. There is a trailer, the body of which seems good, but I think the wheels, tires, bearings will all need to be rebuilt/replaced. How much will it cost me to replace all the lines, assuming I don't order them all straight from Hobie and get them somewhere for less? What if they're all from hobie?

Secondly, when i decide to start upgrading, how much will epo's, windicators/vanes, hotstick, cat trax, 6:1 downhaul run me? I know they're expensive bits, but does anyone know the specifics?

Knowing all this and seeing the pictures I plan to attach (hopefully I get it on the first try) what should I offer the guy for the boat? Keep in mind it hasn't moved for 5 years, so he may not be looking for much more than to get rid of it--who knows. How much is it going to cost me to get this boat in racing condition?

Thanks in advance for all your help everyone!

-Seth

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

By the way, I plan on racing the boat, so if you think it's too old, let me know.

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

Unless you did it after the photos were taken, you didn't check the most important aspect - are the decks soft in front of the trampoline?

RE: The hull number - M84K means it was made in the 10th month (K) of production in 1984.

84's were good (lightweight) boats - but you'll need to spend a lot of $ to get this in racing trim:

Comptip - about $300 (might be able to find one on eBay for considerably less)
Lines - about $200, depends more on what you get rather than where.
Standing Rigging - 24 years is a lot of time even for stainless - about $200
Sails - 24 year old sails will be OK for day sailing, but to race, you'll want new. About $1,500
Rudders - probably most important - $500 for new EPO's.
Cat Trax - $500

Other misc bits - $200 - $500, depending on what you need (does it have a low profile mainsheet system?)

Order a Hobie Catalog and you'll have the prices for all this stuff.

If the decks are soft, walk away.

If the decks are OK, then I'd offer the guy $500, and be willing to pay up to $1000. There's a lot of work to be done.

Trailer work (Tires, bearings, lights?) will be about $150.

If you're serious about racing, you should try to find a 1995 or newer boat.

BTW, I'm UofM NAME '82. I owned an '84 that I bought new.

You can't buy a H16 with snow on the ground, isn't there some sort of law about that.........

I agree with Matt 100%

_________________
Brad Stephens
[email protected]
(866) 786-5266 <--- Advice HOTline
http://www.sunjammers.com
www.facebook.com/sunjammers

Thanks Guys,

The boat does have a comptip, surprisingly. I've been spec'ing out prices on lines and such at murray's and it seems like it'll run me 400 - 600 if I need a new main and halyards.

I checked the hull pretty much everywhere but the top of the deck in front of the tramp. I'll do that this morning--the boat's on my running route.

I ordered the catalog yesterday--just wasn't sure if they would include the prices, as the online catalog did not.

Seems like to replace the bearings, lights, wheels, tires will be more than 150 actually...


Are you saying be willing to pay up to 1000 for the boat alone? Or for the improvements. I think you mean the boat alone, but just making sure...


Anyone know of a boat in better shape?


MBounds - Greate to run into another NAME. What are you working on these days?

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

If the decks are solid, I'd be willing to pay up to $1000 for the boat and trailer as it sits - primarily because it's an '84 (light) has a Comptip and has rake-adjustable rudder castings. Offer $500 and go from there.

But like I said, if the decks are soft, run away. It's not worth it.

For lines - Check out www.hallspars.com. They are having their "Spool End" sale. You can pick up high tech lines at rediculous prices.

I all liklihood, the bearings don't need replacing - just cleaning and repacking.

The Hobie Fleet in Syracuse are a competitive bunch and they turn boats over fairly often. You might be able to find one just a few years old for about $3,500 (which is what you'll end up spending anyway). Check their forum at http://www.fleet204.com/204um/204forum.asp.

I worked at BIW for 3 years right out of school. Went back to Ann Arbor to get my MBA and now I work for a real estate management company. It's funny that almost everybody in my class that I know of ended up out of the NAME field, with a few notable exceptions. Bruce Rosenblatt (ex-SNAME president) was a year ahead of me and Phil Kaiko (my senior project partner) has gone on to work on several America's Cup campaigns. He was the lead designer on the 2002 One World Challenge.

I just checked the boat and the decks seem very solid. They seem thicker around the tramp uprights than the rest of the deck--this is the case, right? It's not that the rest of the deck is deteriorating?

I'll check out those boats--the only difference is that I'll be able to do this boat incrementaly, as far as pure upgrades go, once I get it fit to sail at all. Though, those boats are probably newer, which is obviously and advantage. This hull seems in good shape though ignoring the dirt.

Small world--I know Bruce and his family personally. I've been to their house and spoken with him on numerous ocassions. I'm the president of our student section of SNAME at Webb so met him through that.

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

So I spec'd out rigging costs and here's what I came up with:

$ 196 to replace all rope lines and no upgrading
$416 to replace all lines, including 6:1 dh and aus style jib halyard

$375 for wire rigging - including jib halyard. If I get the aus style halyard, can I take out the $55 wire jib halyard?

So total is $571 or $791--Quite an amount for line. If the main sheet doesn't need to be replaced, I'll save ~$50. Is it recommended that I replace every wire line on the boat?

I'm keeping in mind that these are retail prices (murray's) so I may be able to get line cheaper by looking around and getting at clearance prices.

I haven't checked the Hall website yet.

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

hey man there is a great used market out there. There is a guy here in VA who parts out old hobies. I got a set or EPO rudders and upgraded mainsheet blocks for about 250 along with a bunch of other odds and ends. Also check out west marine the one near me always has line on clearance. You can also build the downhaul for alot cheaper than the kit. So far I have only found the aussie halyard kit to be cheaper as a kit but that is without using discounted line. I would offer 500 and go from there and expect to spend 1500 to get it in good race trim.

I think you also need to take into consideration some of the other items mentioned above if you're seriously looking to getting into racing (i.e. progressing beyond the back of "B" fleet).

Low profile mainsheet blocks are pretty much a must have for all racers.

Also, the jib cars on that boat are a pretty old style. The modern boats have a lower stacking block that cleats directly at the track and are adjustable in and out remotely.

Racing rudders, EPO's or EPO 2's would probably be desired.

Also, be sure to inspect the condition of the tramp. If it's been out in the sun for the past 25 years, it's probably shot.

And of course, 25 year old sails would most likely be blown out and not competetive for any serious racing.

All that said, if this is your first hobie and you can get it for a good deal, get it, race it, and enjoy it. Sail it the way it is and just have fun and if you decide you want to get serious about racing, get a newer one in a few years. But, I don't know that I would put a lot of money into this one to get it fully up to race condition. New shroud wires are a definite must though.

On the bright side, it looks like it comes with a fancy cooler rack!

sm

ha I saw that and I made sure that I could easily remove it...

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10

To answer your question about the jib halyard:

The Aussie halyard replaces the wire halyard, so you can deduct the $55 for the wire.

Make sure that you have (or get) two sets of trapeze wires.

You should be able to save significantly on lines. Use the line lengths from the class website (http://www.hcana.hobieclass.com/?Page=2169). The main sheet length is a bit generous. I've cut mine down to 37'. You can also downsize most of the lines (3/8>5/16, 5/16>1/4).

And I've got a spare set of EPO's that I'd let go, so you wouldn't have to buy new ones for $450.

_________________
Trey Brown
www.velocitysailing.com
2006 N20 1017
1998 H16 102698
www.sunjammers.com ftw!

Check out E-bay, There is a new complete standing rigging set for sale for $93.

buyer - Do you have a link to that by any chance? I went to "Boat Parts" and searched "Hobie" and saw some jib sheets and bridles and some other stuff, but not a whole set...

Trey - What do a used pare of EPO's typically cost?

_________________
A ship in harbor is safe -- but that is not what ships are built for.

Webb '10