B Fleet North American Championship

How many people out there would be interested in a B Fleet North American Championship in the Hobie 16?

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http://hobiebob.blogspot.com/

Would splitting the fleet at the end of the event cause problems? As in, if there is 40 boats the top 20 being the gold fleet, the bottom half being the silver fleet. I could see people trying to work them selves out of 19th place to trophy in 20th though.

Hobie 16's? Probably a great idea solely based on the disparity of boats being sailed out there. Older boats weigh more and aren't as stiff. Not every one can afford to keep their platform super competitive, newer boat and sails.

That's the main reason I decided not to race this year. While sailing skill has so much to do with finishing well, starting off with a heavier boat, heavier crew and older rags is certainly a deterrent.

This is unfortunate, because spending an extended period racing and partying with Hobie folks, from all over the nation, is one of the great experiences of owning a Hobie.

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I think you need to offer a whole lot more detail about what you mean.
Is this a separate event held at a different time?
Is it held at the same time with two starts.
Is it held at the same time with two courses?

My strong feeling as someone who has helped run a few Nationals and attended others is that everyone should sail every race together every day if at all possible.
With that said, the organizers, race director and PRO have got to work closely with each other to put on a quality event for all.
The HCA has been successful at this many times.
The big issue at the moment is the daily race limit.
I feel that the daily race limits have more upside that downside.
There are always going to be the guys from the top of the fleet to the bottom that 7 races are fine with them. That's great.
My concern is the people that pack up, say nothing and never come back.
If the attitude continues to be that, this is a Nationals and it should be very hard and we are here to crown a champion, then we will continue to see our numbers drop. Who wants to see a 20 boat Nationals?
Everyone takes vacation time and spends good money to attend.
There has got to be a balance of competition and a good social atmosphere.
There are a lot of very good sailors(past top 20 guys) in the bottom half of the results from Iowa. There are also some unexpected top 20 guys.
So who is A fleet and who is B fleet before the event starts?
Big changes are not the answer. Tweaks are needed.

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Pat Bisesi
Fleet 204 Syracuse, NY

How about a 16 B NAC's in conjunction with 16 Women's and 16 Youth?

Three or four day event seperate from the 16 Open, held in the summer months, so Mothers and students may easily attend.

Sorry Bob, I may be way off your thoughts???

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I like that idea....I sail with my 11y.o., and taking a full week off during the start of the school year is not an option, making it impossible to attend this year's NAC.

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Arie
H 16 107568

There you go, I wasn't thinking of all the parent/sibling teams.

Now, throw in a Grand Masters fleet (both crew >= 55 years old) and you have on-site "Guest Experts"

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I agree with Pat, the poll doesn't allow for different scenario's.

I hadn't even considered a 16B NAC as a separate event. altho the idea of doing it in conjunction with the women & Youts might have merit.

I was more thinking along the lines of doing it at the same time as the 16A NAC and allowing people that want to go to a NAC, an option where they feel as if the can run with the big dogs and not have to compete directly with them.

to go to a 16 NAC for the first time, and run with the top sailors is VERY intimidating to sailors that have never been to a NAC before.

Speaking for myself, I've been to many NAC events on the H-18. Going to the 16NAC with very little experience sailing the 16 was a bit overwhelming. I start fairly aggressively when sailing the 18, and am VERY Competitive, but while sailing at the 16 NAC's I tended to hang back at the starts, and tried to get thru the mark rounding's without compromising the quality of the racing for any of the other sailors on the water.

My mind set was one of "I am here to learn and have fun" and everyone else is racing their primary boat and they are serious and have something they are competing for. The last thing I wanted to do was mess up someone else's race.

MANY First time NAC participants might have the same mind set and having a B-Fleet as an option might encourage them to attend.

At least that is worth exploring to see how many B-Fleeter's might register for the next NAC Event.

Racing them on a separate course, or racing them fewer races is not necessary, you could start them together, and score them separately, or start them separately and race them to a different A-Mark.

I've seen PU race two fleets on two courses set up side by side using the same start/finish line and it worked beautifully.

As Gordo says, think outside of the box,

Try to find ways to encourage EVERYONE to participate no matter their skill level, and we might be amazed at how much the event and the sport might grow.

One thing we know for sure if we do the same thing we have always done, the participation trend line will continue downwards.

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If the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, maybe it is time to water your own lawn.

Okay, here is the $100,000 question: How do you keep the really good guys OUT of B fleet??

Peer Pressure!!
Shame !!
Flogging !!
Keel Haul em !!
Deny them entry to the Puerto Rican Rum Party !!

If someone abuses the B-Fleet designation, rule 69 em

Most, if not all Sailors that belong in A-Fleet would be embaressed to register in B-Fleet.

Quite honestly, I'd bet you that you'd get more sailors registering in A-Fleet that probably should have registered in B-Fleet than the other way around.

I am a perfect example, I would have registered in A-Fleet even if there had been a B-Fleet. and I had NO Business in A-Fleet for my first regatta on a 16 <Grin>

Stephen

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If the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, maybe it is time to water your own lawn.

As a B fleet sailor at best, I would not be too worried about having some of the better guys participating, because the nature of the event would be so much different (it would actually present a good learning experience!). I would not be as concerned about being in the way of those going for the championship as I would be at the NAC, as one of the previous posters alluded to, since the stakes would be much different for a B championship and hackers should be expected.

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Arie
H 16 107568

We'd all have to get 'Hacker' tee-shirts........

It would be nice if the people who vote leave a comment.

I think you guys are heading down the wrong path with this.
Go look at past results from Nationals.
A quick look at the silver fleet from 1999 list guys like Pedro Colon, Rich Mcveigh, Ken Hilk and Slim Johnson. The first three are in the top 15 this year and Slim did well.
That's what can happen.
I was told long ago that sailing one week at a Nationals with the big dogs is equal to another whole season of experince at home.
I know what it's like to struggle at a Nationals

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Pat Bisesi
Fleet 204 Syracuse, NY

Good point Pat, ten votes and only eight posters.

Explain what happened at the 1999 event please. Did you register as Gold or Silver, or was the fleet split after four races? That would explain only seven races for the Silver Fleet? Looks like the top three in Silver pretty much dominated.

Pat, what's "the right path" here?

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Yea Pat, explain 75th place. Did you stop to fish for a while?