2015 AI Capsize

For solo offshore trips (ie just me in the TI), I tie a 20 foot length of 5mm line to the rear crossbar, with a carabiner attached to my 2" wader belt. I have a hand loop tied in the line about 3 feet from the carabiner, so that (If I get the chance) I can take the initial shock load from busting the plastic buckle on the wader belt*. In order to keep things tidy in non-emergency times, I have loops of the line stuffed in a short length of pvc tube, so the line can easily fall out when needed (a small cord retains the tube to the deck so I don't lose it). I also keep a sharp knife on my PFD so I can cut lines if things get messy in an emergency.

It all sounds complex, but it just sits behind my seat til needed.

*I would not expect ongoing large loads on the safety line once stopped in the water, so have not bothered with a serious yachting safety harness.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker

All useful information and it gives me some guidelines for using a safety line. It was the Hakas and being out of the seat that made me think about this. I have a Fire/EMS background and tend to pay a lot of attention to safety.

Thanks

Chris

I’ve heard via the grapevine that some people at Hobie think I hit something when I capsized my 2015 AI, e.g., maybe an oyster trap or whatever. I think that is a likely, even reasonable, reaction from Hobie. But, it was definitely not the case. I’ve sailed AIs for about 8 yrs now. I know when my rudder or daggerboard/centerboard clips something in the water. The day I capsized, the winds were probably too strong to hear anything. But, knowing whether I hit something, I would not have missed that. No, the shear pin broke simply in rough seas. I took that video in my short event report on p2 of this thread. Notice that I did not even focus on the downwind aka, the one that would have been deepest in the water. It was a pretty normal day…rough seas, but nothing extra ordinary. Suddenly the ama was within 14-18” of the hull, and the boat was going over—split second change. My first thought was a strong gust of wind, but the ama folded back should have told me it was a shear pin. It took me a few seconds in the water to realize what had happened. But, there was no bump, no warning of any kind, only the ama folding back along the hull, before I realized something was happening—split second.

BTW, in sailing and kayaking in this area of the Gulf for 20+ yrs, I’ve never seen an oyster or crab trap in the vicinity. Chok Bay, yes, but not out here on the Gulf, not between Rabbit Key and Pavilion Key.

Finally, it is possible I had a bad shear pin. One that had been compromised somewhere—the manufacturing, the assembly, or even my 3 times previous use, although I know how to handle these boats. But, it is possible, that the pin was compromised which led to it breaking…perhaps. I hope that was the case, and it won't happen again. Right now, I must admit, I'm a bit gun shy and looking for ways to prevent this type of capsize again.

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

3 of the 4 first AI's I owned had a failure of a aka shear-bolt on their first or second sail. We think it was shipping and handling to Hawaii and finally to Maui, more than a defect. Many changes, including in the packing and handling of the boats in 8 1/2 years, but it still could happen.

Great discussion on a bad event that turned out well, but with much loss of long-time collected and expensive (treasured?) equipment and tools. It could happen to any of us. I'm revising how I carry emergency equipment (again!) with the thought of access while on the water in too-rough conditions, or even while in the water! Like how to get the one needed item without loosing most of the others.

I've got the leashing down (inside the hull and out) after many years (and minor loses) while white-water canoeing. But, I still need to refine, one-handed access to any single piece while keeping the boat controlled in wild conditions or while in the water. With enough work I could get my epirb out of my pelican "ditch" box while in the water, but probably not without loosing most of the other loose important rescue and repair parts, tools and gear in the box.

Be safe out there. I'm glad we are all here to talk about it Keith.

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Hobie Island Sailing since 2006

Very interesting info on this thread. I have a 9 foot surfboard calf leash. I used it a couple of times, but not lately. Have to rethink that. Ive busted the shear pin once getting tumbled by waves in the surf on an emergency beach landing. My partner for the day had dry pants with socks attached and he filled with water which weighed him down he had to crawl out of the surf on to the beach. He could have drowned feet from the shore. I was dumped between the shore and the boat, and had the TI land on me with the next wave. I had a second chance and escaped to the beach leaving the boat in the surf. Boat was rescued by able bodied surfers. I use a climbers loop as a step ladder attached to rear xbar as std rigging. I have used tethers religiously will add padeyes with ss ring for hard line attachment point instead of relying on bungee in rear cargo area. I will also keep shear pins on PDF.

How would u add leg straps to a pdf

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https://www.flickr.com/photos/a8cmg/
https://www.youtube.com/user/mastery415/videos

Hey Keith, Thanks so much for the trip report... great info as I intend to do an expedition loaded capsize test myself sometime this summer.
The ensuing discussion is also a wealth of info as well!
From this report and the discussions I have some takeaways that I will implement on my excursions from now on:
1- I will add some kind of backup lines on the Amas to help limit a sudden collapse. This WILL happen again!
2- Although I have been religiously tethering all on deck equipment, I typically use special custom tied bungy cord for this... obviously I need to review this! I do not rely on the stock deck bungys to simply hold items to the deck, my custom bungy tethers have a loop tied in one end that is solidly attached the item to be tethered BUT at the other end I have a fairly weak (and somewhat unreliable) plastic hook similiar to what Hobie furnishes. I think I need to get rid of these plastic hooks and instead use a tied loop in both ends of the bungy cord and then use some kind of "gated" caribiner like device to attach to the tethering points.
3- I will pay much more attention to the front hatch seal... a hull 1/3 full of sea water as happened to you is not acceptable.
4- I think pool noodles in the hull are good insurance in case of hull breach or hatch seal leak.
5- Handles near the seats will be added to my 2015 TI and some kind of righting lines will be added to both the AI and the TI.

I have one question though, it appears that your AI 2 never fully turtled... did you notice any tendency for it to do this? (My greatest fear is a full upside down turtle, probably much harder to recover from...)

Glad you came out of this relatively unscathed and now you have a whole summer to replace the lost items with even better items!

Don

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Don Haynes
Aka TriBlue

2005 Outback Red
2011 Adventure Blue converted to an Island
2015 Tandem Island Red

E-mail: [email protected]

You would have to get them sewn on, or buy a PDF which includes them.

BTW, did your partner have a wader belt on, or some other method of restricting water ingress into the legs? I have swum in my waders and the belt kept almost all the water out.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

Tony, if the dry pants with socks that Clint is referring too are the same as mine, they have a 4-inch wide, tight neoprene waist band. The small of your back creates an opening through which water can readily gain access. If you are in the water 1-2 hours, even with a belt, I think you will take on considerable water--just my opinion, of course, or as Fusioneng would say, "just my 2 cents."

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

I keep wondering about another possibility..

If I understand correctly (which I could have wrong), after the capsize you found both the sheer pin busted and the "knob" missing. Is it possible that the initial failure was the knob working loose resulting in the ama collapse and then the sheer pin got busted during the washing machine part of trying to right the craft?

Good info here by the way.. I also have to be able to collapse my amas (both sides) for a ramp I use at one lake I sail at. After you launch, you have no choice but to use a guest dock to tie the boat up while getting your vehicle parked. You have to use this guest dock both coming and going and its easy and actually works very nicely if you collapse an ama. But it makes some sort of safety tether a pain as you would have to be able to “turn this on and off” out on the water and it has to work for both sides.

That is a good point, Walt. It caused me to do a double take when you said that. But, no, I don't think that is what happened. If the knob/ball came loose first, the brace would fall off and, there would be no pressure on the shear pin to break. The shear pin was broken.

On the other hand, Fusioneng on the previous page of this thread says,
"My worst nightmares would be ripping the gudgeon off the back of the boat, or breaking that ball off the hull that holds that aka brace." The emphasis is mine. I've lost 2 of those knob/balls. One, back in 2007, when I was following Hobie's manual, I transported my new AI top down 70 miles on a fishing trip only to find one knob/ball missing at the dock. Then, as I did during my recent capsize, I found a knurled knob/screw in my parts that fit. It is a good temporary fix. However, I strongly recommend people carry a couple spare knob/balls and screws. I had one but gave it to Terry Wilson (RIP) about a year ago and never replaced it in my parts box. I have 2 on order.

Hobie's part number for the "ball/brace" is 79525001, and the screw 8030212. They are shown on p52 of Hobie's March 2015 Parts and Accessories Catalog. I put this ball/screw in using Loctite Blue Superglue.

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

Looks like I will be adding a spare ball to my parts kit.

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2015 Hobie Tandem Island Hibiscus
"Third Normal Form"

• Trampolines
• Hobie cover
• Davis Spar Fly
• Kayakbob's Sprayskirts
• Spine Board Hakas

I need to talk to some friends of mine to confirm but I think they had a "gentle" capsize because that ball came loose - which is why I was wondering about it causing the original fault.

I checked "my balls" (2015 TI) and both are tight. You cant check your balls often enough (lol..) Hobie had an interesting problem. I remember about in January when we were all chomping at the bit to get boats and new product. I was a little worried about getting something fairly new before they had worked out the production bugs but overall am very pleased with the boat. But.. little details like did those mounting balls get good locktite on assembly might be something to check (given the circumstances back in January - don’t forget about the shipping strikes going on also).

By the way, good for Hobie for creating some great craft and having the demand "problem" they are having. I’m sure a lot of other sailboat manufactures wish they had the same "problem".

I am planning on practicing my re-entry this weekend on my 2015 AI and am looking for the best way to capsize it in the canals at my house. When I capsize the AI (not sure how I will do this yet) will the sail go nose down or will it lay across the water like a Sunfish would (the canal is around 11' deep)? I plan on doing it with both ama's out (then folding one in while it is capsized), and then seeing the best way to re-entry.

Any suggestions are welcomed.

James

2015 AI
2006 Quest

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James

2006 Quest
2015 AI

I tried to tip my "classic" AI (2010) over with the amas out - no way in heck to even come close to doing this. I think you will have to collapse at least one ama to tip the boat over.

The classic AI could flip with the amas out (I never did this but came close) and the boat goes straight to turtle. The TI pretty much has to have an ama collapse in order to capsize. I suspect the new AI is more like the TI.. the only time you will capsize is if the ama collapses..

At least.. that is what I think.. could be wrong.

Keith, one thing I thought was interesting about your story is how hard it was to get back up on the boat after you had it back upright. Last year I capsized a C15 (planning dingy) and at age 58 (59 now) the very hardest thing about the recover was simply getting back into the boat after I had it upright. Im just not as strong as I used to be and that was actually the scariest part of the whole capsize.