clothes recomendation

we have a new to us ti.We got very wet last time out. Any recomendations on clothes to buy (don't want to wear a traditional wetsuit) fastbruce

Because of the nature of the Islands - drysuits are not exactly ideal. On the Islands, water comes up from beneath you, so you're going to get wet. Water will get past the dry suit. Count on it.

I shifted to a pair of Zhik Hydrophobic Fleece top and bottoms. Yes, I get soaked, but I'm not cold. The stuff is very warm. I still wear a dry top sometimes just to cut down on splash, but just the fleece on the bottom. Cost me about $200 total and I won't go back to a dry suit.

I don't know what you're basing that comment on, but we have never had the first drop of water get past our dry suits.

fastbruce, as to your question I would say it depends on your budget as well as the conditions in which you will be using your Island. There are several people quite content with two piece ensembles. They tend to be a lot less expensive too.

We use ours in water temps as low as the upper 30's so far, and I wouldn't consider anything but a dry suit in those conditions. We also are very happy using our drysuits in weather as warm as the mid 70's regardless of the water temp. I get cold when I'm wet somewhere in the mid to upper 70's particularly when the sun isn't out.

Basing it on the fact that I always have water get past my drysuit somewhere. So rather than worry about being wet, I've opted for just being warm.

Your results may certainly be different from mine, of course.

I decided to buy a pair of hobie spray jackets and waterproof pants at big 5
hope that does the trick,

Fastbruce wrote: we have a new ti and on our last outing got pretty wet. any recomendations on type or brands to buy?


Fastbruce,

I like the chest wader and paddle jacket combo. Water here is in the 50's (F) at best in summer. 40's in the winter. The waders are great for wading all around the boat while launching, retrieving, setting up in the surf, beaching, etc. My favorite launch site requires peddling under a low bridge after launching and before sailing. Thus, stepping the mast and rigging the sail has to be done in surf where the shore drops off rapidly. Just 1 foot waves breaking over the boat and pushing it around while you're trying to drop a mast straight down - but enough to annoy. The bow of the TI is pulled up on shore and the stern may be in 4 feet of water. Chest waders are wonderful.

A strong tidal current flowing over the launch ramp creates similar problems. If I don't get out there in at least thigh deep water and have a wrestling match with the TI, it ends up on the trailer 90 degrees to the tongue and the car. Chest waders are wonderful.

The one drawback of most chest waders is the lack of a zipper. I think Kokatat and Palm have some with a horizontal zipper not far below my navel. Not sure what it's for. Can't think of man nor beast that's built to make any use of it. I suppose you're supposed to stretch the elastic shoulder straps to lower the slot. Sounds dangerous to me -- especially if you're sitting on a hatch cover trying to irrigate a drive well. Besides which, the zipper is so waterproof and hard to pull that it requires a toggle nearly as big as the bow handle on an Island. Not sure I could get it open in a water related emergency or get it closed for the next big external wave.

Simms (Simmsfishing.com) makes a wader with a vertical zipper all the way from the top to a bit above where the zipper on a pair of jeans stops. It is waterproof, but is something a normal human, who can no longer open a jar of tomatoes for his wife, can operate in a hurry. In addition to being useful for avoiding peddling with your legs crossed, this zipper is useful for putting on and taking off the waders. As one wag on the Yakass.net kayak fishing forum said: "No more hopping around the parking lot on one foot."

The down side is that the Simms are super high quality. Simms is the Rolls Royce of fly fishing gear. These chest waders cost $750.00 American. For that I can buy a dry suit and have change left over for a large cup of tea to help me try out the zipper.

Sooo... I bought a pair of Caddis (Caddiswaders.com) Northern Guide Breathable Relief Zipper Front Chest Waders with neoprene booties for about $180.00 (American) from Amazon. Love em. Zipper goes at least as low as my blue jeans -- maybe lower. I tried on the Simms, and I do not see the difference except for a few gadgets for fishermen. (Simms does have belt loops -- very useful!)

One caution: Caddis just came out with a new model -- virtually identical except they have hand warmer pockets (which ruins the water proofing of the old model pockets) and sizing is slightly different. I sent a pair back to Amazon twice before calling Caddis and discovering that Amazon is out of the Regular Mediums -- and is selling the Tall Mediums as Regulars. Marked M on the box and MT on the wader. So, I bought my third pair directly from Caddis, got the new model (now $220) for the old model price. Nice folks. The woman on the phone was very helpful & diplomatic making sure that I ordered the right size out of 13 possible size combinations. Note too that price varies by size.

Had to buy a pair of Teva Sandals one size bigger than my normal shoe size to go over the neoprene booties. Had hoped to use something cheap from Target, but summer swim wear has been put to bed till next year. If you go the sandal route, you need one that has 3 adjustable straps so that it can fit over the big fat neoprene bootie, without getting a foot bed so big you trip over it.


Puget

There is often a question about waders filling with water if you take a dunking, and dragging down the wearer -- or at least preventing climbing back onto a boat. That was probably a legit concern with older semi rigid rubber waders. For modern waders, take a look at this video: Exploding the Waders of Death Myth:

[youtube]http://youtu.be/OYwG52p4yjs[/youtube]

We are both singing in the same choir Puget! I bought the zipless Caddis waders ($115 I think it was), as with my elevated "captain's chair" it is quite doable to get my waders down to my knees without p*ssing in them (LOL).

Not only do I concur with that brilliant video dispelling the "waders of death" myth, but >I have actually swum in mine<, and they were hardly even noticeable. When I stood up afterwards, about 20 litres of water held captive by my wader belt came out when I leaned forward, and later on, I reckon I had maybe one litre of water down each leg, hardly an issue.

So I agree 100%, lightweight breathable chest waders, combined with a lightweight top (mine is a breathable cycling wind jacket) is an extremely practical setup for Island sailing.

_________________
Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker

Glad to know that I can still handle an emergency if the zipper sticks!

By the way, I forgot to mention that in my wader research I did come across a pair of women's waders with a zipper. I don't remember the brand, but I recall that the zipper was for a panel of some sort in the back of the wader.

I don't use waders, but that sounds similar to the Kokatat women's drysuit with a drop-seat option. (I once read a post by a man with bowel problems who was annoyed that Kokatat don't offer it on their male-fit suits, because he'd have found it very useful.) Another way of tackling the "convenience" issue is the Peak Creek drysuit, becoming popular in Britain. Its entry zip is through the legs (ankle-crotch-ankle) which also works as a relief zip.

Mary

I agree with him. Either of those zipper arrangements sound like they would be quite useful for men as well as women. And not just men with special problems.

I too have to jump on this comment. Water gets past your DRY suit? How is that? A Dry suit is dry. IF water is getting in, you have the wrong size.

To answer the question posed, I wear a 3 or 5mm Shorty Wetsuit and at times have gone for my full suit that is extreme at 8mm but only if it's cold out. I get them wet and let my body heat it back up before going out. I wear the Hobie Spray Top / jacket over the suits if the wind is really kicking. (Nasty = Fun!)
Admittedly, I had a heart attack at $150 US original price for the spray top. Not sure if my whine helped but now they are $99. You cannot beat them at any price.
I have been out in 46 degree water for 6 hours and no issues

_________________
Mark AKA: River
2011 AI in Red Hibiscus
Lowrance Elite 4, W Gold card
Garmin GPS 78
Standard Horizon HX 751
2 12V 700ma batteries in Parallel
Solar charging
Ritchie Compass
14 days of electronics easy

Put on your dry suit and then submerge yourself for just a half minute in the water. You'll get wet.

Keeping out splashes is one thing, staying warm if you get wet is another and the type boats we're talking about are prone to tasks that will have you in the water. Launching, landing, capsizing (it happens), etc. If you have on some good hydro fleece it won't matter if you do get wet. You won't be cold. Not for awhile anyway.

I wear lightweight breathable waders and a dry top as mentioned by several above. But I also wear the Zhik hydro fleece underneath. I'm prepared for just about anything that way.

I have a dry suit by Kokatat that I never get wet in, even after sitting all day. I have also dunked myself many times to cool off a bit and have never had water enter.
Are you sure you are not confusing internal condensation with leakage? That is a very common thing for people to do, even with gore-tex. I don't know how many times I heard " my gor-tex is leaking", only to find it was condensation.

Chest waders have evolved from ones that could drown you to ones that actually provide some buoyancy. Several years ago, I raised this controversy in the forum and was quickly attacked for stating that waders could fill with water and pull you down. This was not anecdotal as I had fallen into a deep pool while fly fishing and would not have made it, if not for a friend who pulled me out.
I have subsequently replaced the waders (with a 'modern-insulated' pair) and jumped into the lake...the new waders were cumbersome with water in them...but they did provide some positive buoyancy. So my recommendation is that if you choose to wear waders on your AI/TI...make sure that the waders have some buoyancy.

I am easily chilled...I wear my Kokatat dry suit quite often here in Minnesota. I wear polypropolene under it to wick away any perspiration. I have never had it leak more than a couple of drops...usually when I fidget with the cuffs. I bought the suit from REI with the understanding that I would immediately go home...jump off the dock, and if it leaked they would replace it with a different size or refund my money. I kept the suit. Wearing it, I sort of wish that they would have designed it similar to an astronaut's suit. More than once I have scrambled to open the suit for an 'emergency".