Lessons Learned from an Ill Fated Dive Trip

I agree with Keith on the Hakas. With the tramps I have now I can't fold in the amas without rolling them up. Also, there are a bunch of of people who seem perfectly happy with their nonfoldable homemade hakas.

I don't have a lot if spare time to put into making hakas, so all I would need is an "add to cart" button. I guess I'll start looking for aluminum bleacher seats in the meantime...

what year is your TI? i had this happen to my wife and I in our brand new first year first model TI (2010 i believe) in the middle of the Chesapeake (Annapolis) bay shipping channel under the bay bridge in about 3-4 foot rolling waves and right where the current picks up and changes directions so definitely not a place i want to swim nor want my wife to swim.

since then they made some modifications to the connections and they never came out again. now i have a 2012 model and still have PTSD of that moment and can't help but stare at the connector point when in bad weather situations. i just feel like a lot is riding on that one small point and if it fails then you are assed out in the ocean (well for me at least).

but i'm really glad to hear that you guys handled it and no one was hurt.

rusty_sojah,
Mine is a 2014. I just bought it in August.

The Hobie Haka should be able to handle 250# on center (typical of a camp chair). I know nothing about manufacturing, but they make various spine boards. It shouldn't be much different to make a suitable haka. I'm sure most spine boards can handle up to 400#. I think a haka should be able to handle 250#, maybe 275#. If someone needs more than that, they can do further strengthening as necessary.

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

I think you just experienced our worst nightmare Totch. Lots of lessons learnt for all of us. That's what this forum is all about. Thanks for sharing.

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Don't take life too seriously................it ain't permanent.

Another thought on Hakas is if you do have them on the boat, and the boat capsizes, are you able to still right the boat ( I think about that kind of stuff). My preference in my circumstances was to simply strengthen the existing tramps, and incorporate more load bearing spray skirt areas to my TI vs adding Haka's. Though I really haven't had any major issues with the tramp catching wind and flipping the boat (simply because if I'm in those conditions I'm usually sitting on that tramp to prevent the boat from capsizing anyway), I am fully aware that this condition exists. I have thought about adding a couple slits into my tramps to help spill wind.
I try to work around what is already in the design, instead of replacing the tramps with HAKA's, I'm just trying to improve the functionality of what's already there.
I'm not against HAKA's in any way, I just don't want to spend a great deal of time and money making something that replaces something that is already on my boat that I don't have many issues with that I use all the time (ie... the tramps).
Of course everyone's circumstances are different.
Bob

I don't think one should think of hakas replacing tramps. They are 2 different accessories. I do have a friend who regularly took his sons out on his tramps, but the fasteners broke and the tramps slung too low in the water. My friend bought my original, very strong hakas and was happy with them.

I seldom go out in winds less than 15 mph, gusting to 18-20 mph. Tramps just seem a bit scary in those conditions. Hakas serve much the same purpose as tramps without the downsides of dragging in the water when loaded or catching wind and possibly flipping. Many like their tramps--that is fine with me. Obviously, everyone sails in different conditions and has different needs.

Many on this forum have expressed a desire for Hobie to market a set of hakas. Hobie markets a huge number of accessories. A simple design haka for which there is a ready market seems like a no brainer. As you say, Bob, just my 2 cents.

Keith

_________________
2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

Well, after looking at a number of different ideas, I think I'm going to try the cheap route and complicate it from there (I tend to do the opposite). I'll probably buy a couple of 2 x 12 x 8' for $10 a piece, mount a little hardware, and ratchet down the tanks and other dive gear to them. Will try to keep the tramps on for lighter stuff and will tether and harden as per suggestions. I may try aluminum bench seats or some other material later as I get more comfortable with hakas. I need to experiment with best ways to mount and unmount before spending too much money or time. Lots to look at on the haka topic too.

2 x 12 x 8 is a lot of weight!

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Hobie Island Sailing since 2006

I am reminded of Slaughter's simple ultra lightweight solution using zinc coated cable trays. To make them more dive tank friendly, just buy some cheap closed-cell exercise mats and cut them to cover the trays.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker

Yes, Totch, that is way too much weight and far more strength than you need. Build a set like my original hakas--probably weighed 14# each & supported 400+ lbs when both my friend & I sat on one together. http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=37645&p=200342#p200342 or you can do a lighter set, which still handles my 190# easily: http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=7276&start=240 My next set of light weight hakas will use a minimum of screws and simply use SS bolts/washers/nuts in holes thru the wood--not as pretty, but stronger & easier to build.

Keith

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2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

Totch:
If your concerned about hauling the tanks strapped to the aka bars, what we do is just fill up a 4 person inflatable boat (650 lbs capacity (about $40 bucks at Walmart)) we have both a foot pump and an adapter that we bought at the dive shop that allows you to fill up the boat with a scuba tank (it uses up a couple hundred lbs of your air to fill the boat, but only takes a minute or two to fill the inflatable boat).
We then just tow the inflatable about 15 ft directly behind the center of the TI. When we have way too many divers or way too much gear (we usually do) we just throw the tanks, gear, coolers, etc into the raft and tow it. It tows very easily and doesn't effect steering (which can be a big problem), it's honestly hard to notice it's back there.
Whenever in key west we always seem to have way too many people when we go out snorkeling, we used to bring along our hard kayaks and tow them all over (two revo's and an oasis) but that's too many boats to be hauling back and forth from sarasota to KW. So now we just use cheap inflatable kayaks (usually about $150 bucks at Walmart) and stuff them in the back of the SUV, however we found that kayaks really suck at hauling gear (they flip over). We typically just have the kayakers hang onto the dingy (it doesn't work out too well having them hang onto the TI (small rudder....loss of steering....), we haven't lost anybody yet (lol). But then again we typically only go out in realy low wind, flat water, and we don't typically go very far out with the 'party barge'. When we know we will have a lot of toys to fill up with air we typically just pay the $10 bucks or so to rent an extra scuba tank that we keep in the back of the SUV, we also have an inflator that works on the car battery. We usually have a couple big coolers along, one for lobster/crab and spear fishing catch and the other for food and drinks, never have figured out a good place to put them on the TI, crab traps are also kind of a pain to haul.
Bottom line we just go out and have fun and try to stay safe out there doing the things we like to do, and that's what we pretty much have our TI rigged to do (we live here, that probably also makes a difference, and are out most weekends).
Just have fun
Bob

Bob, you need to provide pictures of your set up. Totch might get the idea that you have an off-the-shelf tandem and that might lead him astray.

Keith

_________________
2015 AI 2, 2014 Tandem

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex ... It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." A. Einstein

"Less is more" Anon

Keith:
Good suggestion, I would never do anything like that on purpose.


Everyone:
Here is a video of some of the stuff I did to my TI to prepare it for offshore (mostly in the keys), these are my local waters (this makes a difference (local knowledge is very important in the both the keys, and the glades))

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BcdE0137Xk