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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 1:53 pm 
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Quote:
Hobie only offers 2 styles of sails for the H16, all white or red/smoke. I did not like either option. Since Hobie does not do custom colors


Incorrect statement quoted above.

Hobie offers 3 sail options for the H16, white being one of them, the others pictured below. Also, Hobie does offer custom sail options using any of their available colors. I just had one made myself.

Image

Image

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 2:56 pm 
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How much for a full set?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:18 pm 
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ericweller wrote:
2) What is so special about a Hobie sail? It does not have a curve formed in the sail shape....It is pretty much a triangular, flat Dacron product.


Wow, that is about the most inaccurate statement I've seen posted in a while. If that were the case, I don't think anyone would be buying Hobie sails.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:51 pm 
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Again, not trying to sound like a jerk, but these forums stick around for years and years, which is why I try to comment when errors are posted...To save the next guy from hassle, and from making an ill informed decision.

ericweller wrote:

1) The quality is good. I had to take a leap of faith that FX will do a good job, but after seeing the final product, I was very pleased. As far as standing behind their product, when my sail ripped when the batten popped out of the pocket, FX fixed the sail for free, whereas I seriously doubt Hobie would have done that.


I don't know why the sail ripped in the first place, but I have never had a brand new Hobie sail tear at the batten pocket when the battens were properly installed. Hobie has one of the best warranties in the sailing industry, bar none.

ericweller wrote:
2) What is so special about a Hobie sail? It does not have a curve formed in the sail shape. There is no high tech fabric. It is pretty much a triangular, flat Dacron product. As such, as long as the experienced sailmaker at XYZ has the proper specs of the sail, they should be able to produce a quality product similar to what Hobie produces. Yes, the sail is the lighter weight Dacron since some colors are not available in the heavy weight Dacron. But, less weight makes the boat go faster.


Not really. For example, a small boat specific sail maker, like say, Glaser sails, understands how the rigs and boats act through the water. Their designs are much different than, say, a loft that produces cruising boat sails (like FX).
With a lighter cloth, what will happen is the sail will bag-out between the battens very quickly. I can tell from the picture from all of the wrinkles in the main that the cut isn't right. How do you think I could tell that it's lighter cloth from a 1"X1" picture on the internet?

Also, the lighter material will stretch much more quickly on the leach and luff due to the relatively high load of the mainsheet blocks and the downhaul.

The jib will stretch and in a very short time you won't have the ability the sheet the jib properly because the blocks will bottom out. It looks like it already will go block to block unless you move the tack up a few holes. It's like robbing Peter to pay Paul, and as the sail stretches it get's worse.

ericweller wrote:
3) I don't really care about racing other than play racing other boats that happen to be sailing around me. I would venture to guess that 90% of H16 sailors couldn't care less about being class legal, but they do want their boat to stand out.


I personally will not even broker a boat with aftermarket sails or tramp due to the inferior quality of some of them. Generally speaking, the aftermarket sails and tramps look good for a fraction of the time as the Hobie brands. For the most part, they just don't last as long.

ericweller wrote:
Hobie only offers 2 styles of sails for the H16, all white or red/smoke. I did not like either option. Since Hobie does not do custom colors, I had to go elsewhere. I don't think someone who has Tequila Sunrise color scheme would be willing to go to a Hobie sail and lose the colors they have. The options they have is to buy some 20 year old POC or find someone who will duplicate the color scheme.
IMHO, it doesn't matter if you're class legal, but you have to have a nice looking boat.


As pointed out, that's false.

There are few lofts that I can think of that would make a comparatively good sail for a Hobie 16 at a similar cost. The H16 sail is a very labor intensive sail to build.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:20 pm 
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Location: Atlanta, GA
Thanks for all of the information.
I wish I had all of this info when I was deciding on who was going to make the sails.
Is it a new policy for Hobie to make sails with custom colors? I read that they do not do custom jobs due to the cost of maintaining a color inventory. How much do they charge for a full sail set with custom colors?
Thanks!

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:02 pm 
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This is all good. I get that the Hobie sails are good, and if my daughter planned to race, I would get the Hobie Sails.

Anybody know where I can buy a new Hobie Jib for $240 for a 4 oz white, or $300 for a 5 oz. Chip's prices seem reasonable and he's obviously not a beginner at this.

If anybody has a white or solid yellow Hobie Jib is near-new condition, I may be interested.

Another point is that it seems difficult to get info on Hobie Sails and what, beyond being class legal makes them better. They could promote them better and probably sell more.

Phil


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:06 pm 
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ericweller wrote:
(W)hen my sail ripped when the batten popped out of the pocket, FX fixed the sail for free, whereas I seriously doubt Hobie would have done that.

You're right, but the Hobie sail wouldn't have ripped in the first place because it's got the proper batten pocket caps to keep the battens in place.

ericweller wrote:
What is so special about a Hobie sail? It does not have a curve formed in the sail shape. It is pretty much a triangular, flat Dacron product.
Wrong, wrong, wrong.

ericweller wrote:
Yes, the sail is the lighter weight Dacron since some colors are not available in the heavy weight Dacron. But, less weight makes the boat go faster.
Wait, what? Weight has nothing to do with speed. It has everything to do with holding its shape over time, which a lightweight sail won't do.

ericweller wrote:
Hobie only offers three standard styles of sails for the H16, all white, Seabreeze Imageor Hot TamaleImage.
Fixed it for you.

ericweller wrote:
Since Hobie does not do custom colors, I had to go elsewhere.
Wrong again. Hobie will make any pattern you want, as long as they have the color. When I went looking for a custom color, class legal sail for my 14, I had at least a dozen colors to chose from. Lots of people get custom sails from Hobie. Sure, you can't re-create a Tequila Sunrise, but you could create something nobody else has. Something that stands out.

Sorry to put you down so hard, but I won't let information like that propagate. It's just wrong.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:08 pm 
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By the way, are the Hobie Sails normally 4 or 5 oz cloth?

This is kind of an interesting dynamic, as the other one designs that we race (Flying Scots) have a rule that sails are open to any manufacturer, but the sails have to measure in. They have strict rules on cloth, colors, advertising, etc, and the class gets $20 per sail as a royalty.

Thus North, Quantum, Ullman, Mad, Gus, Shurr all make good sails for the class.

Phil


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:29 pm 
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I'll ask again... how much for a full set of sails with the Tequila Sunrise pattern?

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1980 H16
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:34 pm 
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Location: Detroit, MI
sawyerspadre wrote:
By the way, are the Hobie Sails normally 4 or 5 oz cloth?
Neither. It's 5.6 oz cloth.

sawyerspadre wrote:
This is kind of an interesting dynamic, as the other one designs that we race (Flying Scots) have a rule that sails are open to any manufacturer, but the sails have to measure in. They have strict rules on cloth, colors, advertising, etc, and the class gets $20 per sail as a royalty.
The flip side to this is the Hobie Class - where we don't have to measure sails, because they all come from the same plotter/cutter.

They used to promote the sails better in the catalog - two pages in the 2004 catalog about how much better they are than the old sails - INOX heavy-duty stainless steel grommets instead of the old metal plates at the clew and tack, reinforced plates at the head and jib clew, larger batten luff caps - the Hobie Cat sails are really, really good now.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:09 pm 
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Cool. If we get into racing it, we would probably upgrade to a newer boat.

Good Hobie Racing is two hours from our home, and good Scot racing is 20 minutes. It's really two different games though.

There used to be a ton of Hobie's at the "Hobie Alley" launch at our lake 25 years ago. Now you see 5 on a really good day, but there is a resurgence of really young people, like my 17 yr old daughter sailing them.

We keep the Scot at Lake Nockamixon.

Phil


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:40 pm 
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sawyerspadre wrote:
Anybody know where I can buy a new Hobie Jib for $240 for a 4 oz white, or $300 for a 5 oz.
Phil


For the reasons stated above, I wouldn't go with lighter cloth.

White Jib: $428.50
Color: $471.75
White Main: $915.75
Color: $1051

Custom. Call your local dealer for price and availability.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:55 pm 
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sawyerspadre wrote:
Good Hobie Racing is two hours from our home, and good Scot racing is 20 minutes. It's really two different games though.

There used to be a ton of Hobie's at the "Hobie Alley" launch at our lake 25 years ago. Now you see 5 on a really good day, but there is a resurgence of really young people, like my 17 yr old daughter sailing them.

We keep the Scot at Lake Nockamixon.

Phil


If you're thinking about racing, you should contact Fleet 416, based out of Lake Nockamixon. They're still an active Hobie fleet (hosting the Northeast Area Championships this year). There is a good group of Hobie sailors in that fleet (including past national champions). You're right about the 2 hour travel time for most regattas, but I guarantee, it's worth the trip.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 6:45 pm 
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I want to check out the local fleet. We used to windsurf at some of the same spots that they have the local region series and they are all good, windy bays. Wide open, sail-to-the-layline kinds of spots that seem perfect for these boats.

Trixies, Dewey, etc.

First step is have a usable jib.

Thanks guys,

Phil


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