Outback / Revolution Catamaran options?

Kind of a resurrection of this thread:

http://www.hobiecat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=35878

But I wanted to get some more feedback. For more reasons than 1, I am leaning away from the PA and leaning towards either the OB, or Revo. I hope to one day just have 1 of each, like Tom

Anyway, part of the topic I am interested in, is the strength of the plastic on the boats. My thought of this option was posted with linking the OBs together with a contraption of PVC pipe and using the rod holders on the OB as a socket to allow for up and down motion (such as the system with the AI AMA/AKAs). My concern though is with the lean of the individual kayak and the stress it would place on the plastic from twisting when a person was in it....either port / starboard lean or Forward / Aft lean. The PVC setup would be easier with the Outbacks being as they have more rod holders....I believe the Revo would risk tearing plastic with a clamp or mount in the front.

One thing I thought of is if you were to reinforce each rod holder with either a PVC sleeve or Rod holder insert, just to allow for better structural integrity. Option 2 could be 2 ram mounts on each boat (like at least 2" ball) and mount a bar going across with a loose clamp to allow for articulation.

The ultimate idea would be to have this "catamaran" setup, and maybe on the rear of the platform, attach a small trolling motor or small outboard. Could also have 2 hobie sails on the front of each boat and synch them together somehow; or if it were strong enough, could have an AI sail right in the middle of the forward rail.

I haven't completely ruled out the PA, but being as my wife is now getting interested in the same thing, I think to save some $$$, it may be better to purchase 2 separate yaks.

Decisions, decisions

Let me know what y'all think.

CurtnAz:

Looking at your link, there is another company out there who makes a kit called Kayakamaran ( http://www.sailboatstogo.com/v_page.php ... =Katamayak). I have no idea how good it is.

Before getting our Tandem Island I tinkered with idea of lashing our Oasis and our revolution together with something like this. I ended just making something simple, then eventually bought a TI instead (alot less fooling around, and solved all of our problems).

With the Tandem Island we sometimes go river kayaking with several kayaks, I just leave the AMA's at home. The TI is a great Kayak just on it's own, very fast and stable, much more stable and faster than our Oasis, and only 25 or 30 lbs heavier, and actually easier to car top than the Oasis was (easier to grab because of the handles). We have lashed several Revolutions to our TI a few times making a party barge (mostly for going out to scuba sites or islands across open water), and that works nicely. We lash the kayaks between the Hull and AMA's then have 4 people pedaling the party barge, using the TI sails to pull us along if the wind is right.

My thought is if your just on rivers and don't need to worry about being sea worthy (small kayaks are not real good in open ocean (dangerous). I would take two PVC pipes, run a rope through them, and put D clips on each end. The just clip the ends of each pipe to the bow to bow and stern to stern lift cleats. This will keep the boats parallel. Then tie a rope to the bow and stern of one boat, then with the center of the rope tied in the center of the second boat, this rigging will keep the boats parallel and spaced properly in tandem. Very quick easy and cheap, and shouldn't put any undue stress on either boat, and be easily removed and stored in the hatch.

If you want to add a motor ( I did) just buy one of those kayak motor mount kits that goes into the rod holders on one of the kayaks, then put your motor on. This place has one ( http://www.islandhopperoutboards.com/ka ... NAodSQRe6w )

I have a gas motor that I got at ( http://www.ioutboardmotors.com/?gclid=C ... NAod6nVHUw ). It works great, but I would buy the Hobie Sidekick AMA's and put them on (you would hate to flip, would probably wreck the motor).

The design above doesn't make either of the boats less prone to tipping, you would need some sort of cross bar to achieve that. However it's pretty easy to just lash a paddle between the boats if you need to (we have had to do that in rougher water while trying to sail both boats lashed together). As soon as you start tieing the hulls together as one rigid structure thats when stresses come into play that can damage the boats, but keep everything loose allowing the boats to roll with the waves, I don't see any major issues.

I think the biggest thing is to make it as simple as possible so it can be quickly rigged and taken down when your not using it. I have a feeling that once you make it, you will seldom use it once the newness wears off, at least thats what we found, I carried those stupid pipes and ropes for a couple years in the hull, never used em after the first couple times, finally got rid of them. If one of the boats has a motor, it's just easier when your companion is tired and whining to tow the second kayak with them hanging on to a rope (a long rope if they are really whining).
Bob

Very useful and helpful info Bob. I've thought about a TI for a couple of things, but the price is just outrageous for me right now. What I tend to wonder in some cases, is this; which would only apply to people with an unlimited amount of income I suppose. Tandem Hobie, with 2 Torqeedos Crazy huh. I'll take a look a little more at the TI. What annoyed me on this paddle yak was every time I would take a stroke with my right arm, my wife would stroke with her left Paddles slappin' like crazy. Guess that would be one HUGE benefit to the Hobie Mirage

Thanks for the ideas of rigging as well.

EDIT: Looked a bit at the TI and I really like it, but not the price so much I do have a question. Why do people elect to sit in the rear seat of Tandem kayaks when riding solo? I would think that sitting in the middle would displace the weight more evenly....The more and more I look at it though, the more I like it and think of endless possibilities for the great expansion of Lake Powell. I also view it as if I were in the forward seat, that's a pretty hefty area for cargo in the rear.

CurtnAz:
I'm not trying to convince you one way or another about anything, I'm just describing what works for us (we are avid kayakers, sailers, and scuba divers, and are out on the water every weekend year around). We split our time between Sarasota Florida (south central gulf coast) and Key West. I have probably a thousand miles on our TI now and have really enjoyed every minute of it. I haven't done any modifications to the boat in over a year now, basically using the boat as rigged (though I'm itching to add a big screacher sail).
I posted last year some of the mods that I did to the boat on this forum The ultimate Tandem Island (hydrofoils,spinnaker,jib,etc) ( viewtopic.php?f=69&t=33720 ). The boat is mostly rigged to take advantage of the typical low wind conditions in this area. I'm not suggesting anyone else do any of my mods, I'm only describing what worked out well for us. About halfway through that post you will see the mods we made to our Oasis and revolution kayaks, adding keel weights, and spinnaker sails, etc back in 2007/2008. we used to take both those boats all over the country running rapids, camping, sailing, exploring (a lot of fun times), I'm sure we have way over 500 miles on the Revo and it's still going strong (great boat), we traded in our Oasis in early 2010 when we got the TI (we loved the Oasis also).

I have tried sailing from the back seat and hate it, I prefer the front seat and often ride out on the tramps while underway (very comfortable). When really pushing the boat it's always better to hike out on the tramps to help keep the boat level (goes faster), kind of hard to do from the back seat.

That funny what you said about paddling, my wife and I are exactly the same way with coordinated paddling (she's a little headstrong) and paddles the way she wants to paddle regardless of what I'm doing so we go in circles a lot (we use the whole river). Maybe thats why they call Tandem Kayaks divorce boats LOL.

Now we have the mirage drive boats I pedal like crazy and she pretends to, but at least were going straight. I don't mind though since kayaking is my excercise thing, I can pedal for 8-10 hours, and be right back at it again the next day. We really love Hobies boats, they are the best out there, and the company is by far the best in the business (awesome support).

Funny you mention the torqueedo, I am pondering to enter the Watertribe EC challenge next year in the class VI experimental electric class. If you go to (www.watertribe.com ) you can read about the race, it's a 300 mile race from Ft Desoto, FL to Key Largo, FL. I'm working out the power requirements right now, and it's looking to be possible.
Bob

I never thought you were trying to convince me. You bring up some very valid points with the options and features of the TI, and to be honest, when I was thinking about the PA a while back, it was mainly so I could take one of my daughters with me in the back. With a Tandem, problem solved For $5,000 though....a little steep for my pocket book.

Once again, thanks for the info.

A small aluminum frame similar to what is used on whitewater catarafts or those small fishing catarafts could be used to attach the two Hobie hulls together. The stress of a motor mount could be on the frame instead of the Hobie's themselves.
A section of foam padding could be placed between the two hulls and the frame secured to each boat by using a 1" cam strap (see NRS, www.nrsweb.com) and routing the 1" strap around the hulls (spreading the load) and forcing the Al frame to the hulls.

River runners have been doing this for a long time now on catarafts and Inflatable kayaks and rafts.

The link below is from a company here in NZ. I have seen the set up and the 2 kayaks are connected with quite substantial aluminium tubing.
http://www.switchsports.co.nz/wingman-m ... -range.jpg