dressing for cold wet boating

I missed a great chance to go out this weekend in 20 mile an hour winds, because the temperature was 49 degrees Saturday morning. So far I have a kayak jacket, but nothing else yet for myself and my girlfriend. I have seen some waterproof pants for about 150 dollars, but it just seems so expensive for some plastic pants. I suppose I will just bite the bullet and buy two pair. What concerns me is how you keep your feet warm in a cold, wet boat. And then what about the safety factor? What happens if you fall over with all this heavy gear on? Is your life jacket satisfactory? I bought a used dry suit from ebay, but I can't wear it because it feels like I am being choked to death around the neck. But it didn't have feet anyway, so I still don't have a solution for that. And if I buy the waterproof pants, is there anything specific I should be looking for? Should I buy larger sizes so that I can layer underneath? Or do they come large because you are supposed to layer underneath?

Scuba boots work great. Just be sure to buy a pair with a sole. I have a pair of flats fishing boots I bought at Bass Pro and I have been quite happy with them. They zip up the side and have a cinch strap at the top. The sole have held up well to the rocky conditions (and oyster beds) here in Florida. Price isn't bad either.

Here's a link: http://www.basspro.com/World-Wide-Sport ... 184/148266

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How will rubber boots keep your feet warm in icy cold water? Do they work like a wetsuit where you have to keep a layer of water inside them?

Surf or scuba booties with a tread for the feet.
Dive gloves with textured fingers for gripping.
To keep the rest warm recommend polypropylene and Gore-tex.
You should be able to find surplus ECWS "Extreme Cold Weather System" really inexpensive at a local surplus store if you don't mind used military equipment.
The used recommendation is for the Gore-tex jacket and pants... wearing used polypro is gross.

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Ecws seems to be geared for cold, but not wet.

Madwand
There are times, you try the patience even of Job (look it up under Bible, pls)
Madwand, NEVER buy a personal piece of survival gear on the Net, especially a dry suit. Any suit, wet or dry or half way in between as it has to fit you exactly what it was intended for.
Wet Suit: in the cold times, 5mm is the norm, and yes it needs to get wet before the thin layer of water that it allows in will be your insulation blanket. in extreme cold, people have been known to use both (wet and dry) but for the time being, the wet suit should do you well. (You can also rent them from most diving shops at a reasonable price). Yes as previously mentioned, no matter what you use dry or wet (the extremities are the places where you loose the most heat: Head, Hands, Feet, so don't rent them buy them if you intend to try to stay warm in cold weather)
You mentioned a Dry Suit that you bought on line (bend over so I can kick....)
A Drysuit works on the idea that there is ZERO water coming into your suit, that will mean (hopefully) built in socks, neoprene gaskets around your wrists and your neck. NOTE! These can also be trimmed to fit as needed (by a pro). The dry suit has no insulation layers, it's job is to keep the water off of you at all costs. You layer silk underwear and super fleece as needed to build up your warmth level as the thermo gets lower. DO NOT CHEAP OUT! It could cost you both your lives.
Good now that you have that info, multiply it by 2 so you won't end up being single the hard way.
BTW: 49 degrees is not cold. However factor in the wind chill factors and you may wonder why I strongly recommend you both get proper gear....

If you intend to head out in colder weather, look up Hypothermia and the temp gradients that will give you an idea of how long you will live if the Mr.Chilly hits Mr Willy.

Regards
Fred

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Always looking for ways to make good things 'Gooder'

Yes, I know what wetsuits and drysuits are. I wasn't asking about them. The drysuit was a mistake. I already have a wetsuit and boots. I don't want to wear a wetsuit because this is not what it is designed for. You can't keep a layer of water in it while sitting iin a kayak. My girlfriend in particular is not going to be wearing a skin tight, form fitting wetsuit. The boots, maybe so, but I wonder if they'll be warm enough.

You may live in Canada, but that doesn't mean 49 degrees isn't cold. I live in the tropics, so you probably won't agree with me that 90 degrees is just warm. I do not want to be wet in 49 degrees because that is cold. I don't want to be wet in 75 degrees either, because that, too, is cold.

My interest is in splash pants, or paddling pants. Something I can be dry in and dress warmly as well. If that is indeed what I need, I may try some out at the Backpacker, but I will most definitely be purchasing them online if I find what I want there and know the fit.

This is a timely topic here in the northern hemisphere - the air temp caused me to spend time with Google looking for stuff to use to extend my sailing season for awhile longer rather than actually being on the water this past weekend

I had decided to go with the Kokatat Super Nova semi dry suit. Then I decided to go with the Kokatat Light Weight Paddling Suit (Goretex and 50% more expensive that the Super Nova).

The water is still warm and its supposed to be in the upper 70's here by Sunday, so the pressure is off for this week at least.

Today my sights have been focused on Kokatat's Tempest Paddle Pants w/Socks and thier Paddle Jacket. Most the reviews I read are positive on both these items, though not all of them are. I have a TI, so I too have to buy two sets of whatever I settle on and these are significantly cheaper than the first two options I listed. I also like the fact that I can wear the pants without the jacket when I want to as I have already had a couple outings where I would have liked to have been wearing the pants, but wouldn't have wanted to be wearing a full drysuit.

I also note that I won't be going out in extreme conditions, I don't like riding my motorcycle in less than 50 degree weather, so don't think I would like sailing in colder weather.

I have only seen these items online - the dealer nearest me has a sale going on through the 15th, so I am going to try to get down to see them in person this weekend.

Hey Herb
I have all 3 sets of cold weather wear and 2 sets of warm weather (that so far this year has been about 7 weeks on the east coast of Vancouver Island. On the other side of the Island (Tofino), it's cold weather gear 99% of the time.
I also own a very expensive deep sea cruising suit with a built in harness. It was designed for being above deck on a trans oceanic yacht.
My fave out of the Bunch, is a:

http://www.rei.com/product/783910/kokat ... a-dry-suit

It does all it advertises to do and has never let me down

The problem I've found with split suits is that once you are submerged, you are in deep doodles as it will allow water inside. In very cold water that can be the deal breaker. However, it could work in semi tropical conditions (even though the last couple of years I have seen some screwball weather in Florida that is cold enough to freeze your orange juice on the trees.

The only bench test that I've always used for any new gear: Find the most nasty day of the week and jump in the water and sit there as long as I can. Feck the specs, it's the results of that that will either make me find a niche for it or simply get a refund as non functional.

Regards
Fred

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Always looking for ways to make good things 'Gooder'

Yes, I was just looking at those, you can find them for about $160. Just not sure what sizes to get. http://www.shopsoundboatworks.com/kotepawso.html?cmp=googleproducts&kw=kotepawso has a good sizing chart.

Madwand
If you're going along the route of the separate pants, I strongly suggest that you get Goretex (or Goretex like material) with built in socks. Your 5mm neoprene boots will need to be a bit larger to compensate for them. They will definately keep your feet warm. A good neoprene waist gasket will also keep the water out of your insulation layer(s).
Some people swear by knee high neoprene boots but for your conditions the extra cost might be overkill.
Btw: I may live on Vancouver Island (same conditions as the Pacific NorthWest in the US). I've also sailed in numerous other climates including the tropics. Yup it can get cold in the Tropics (not very often, but with the right low front and a continued amount of exposure to wind chill and spray thus brrr. A notorious place for that can be The southern tip of Baja California in the Winter.
Oh yah you wanted to how big you should get them? A least large enough for a rash guard and fleece layer(s). That's where it gets difficult getting the right fit for the articles when you buy them online.
Keep toasty, buddy
Trinomite

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Always looking for ways to make good things 'Gooder'

Drysuit neckseal can be trimmed, carefully. Search the web for tips on how to do this, and trim a little at a time until it's right. Once you can wear it in reasonable comfort, have a swim in it and make sure it's really watertight. If it passes that test, there are people who can change ankle seals for built-in feet.

Since you've bought the suit, (assuming you haven't already disposed of it) it's worth investing a little time to see if it can work for you.

Mary

Trinomite, I really don't think I wanna pay for Goretex X 2. When it gets that cold, I will be staying inside. I just need something to get me to December when it starts getting too cold to go outside. And I really don't see how anyone can say 49 degrees is not cold. That's 17 degrees above freezing. And it's not a dry cold, it's humid. Always. I know people who live in the cold like to play it off like it's nothing, but 17 degrees above freezing is damn cold, I don't care who you are. But come to my house in Louisiana when it's 110 degrees and 110% humidity and I'll show you when it might be time to take the jacket off...

It looks like the Kokatat Tempest Paddle Pants w/Socks will do what I need for the extra few months.

Dry Suits and paddling pants with ankle seals.
If you look around, this style of gear is heavily discounted right now by retainers.
Why, cause nobody wants them. That ankle seal is the most common cause of cold feet. especially when you launch your boat, you are almost assured of a water leak there.
The only way to counter this (as a compromise is to consider this or something like it):

http://www.rei.com/product/783912/kokat ... ling-boots

Needless the first time you use your built in socks for your suit or pants on a rocky beach with out boots, kiss the socks goodbye.

Fred

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Always looking for ways to make good things 'Gooder'

I'm not seeing it discounted anywhere. Dry suits cost a fortune. I don't want one anyway, don't even know why you mention it. Paddling pants, everyone uses them, everyone wants them. What else is there? They are not discounted anywhere except Campmor where they sell closeouts. I'm not looking at ones with ankle seals. You're not supposed to use the built in socks without boots, so why would you? I've already said I have the boots. Why so negative? Should we stay inside in the winter?