Broken TI Mast Receiver Base Plate?? Pin

Actually it's not a major undertaking to just replace the complete mast receiver assembly with a new one (I've done it a couple times). In order to get at that plate you pretty much have to remove the mast receiver anyway so offering as a separate part won't save anyone any time anyway. And that piece should not break so this should be a warranty fix anyway (defective manufacture). The easiest way to replace would be to just put in a new mast receiver. Think about it, that metal plate and pin represents the bulk of the cost of the mast receiver. If I had to guess the manufacturing cost of that plate is around ten bucks, the big plastic piece is probably three to four bucks, and the rest of the parts including assembly of the sub-assembly is likely four to five bucks. So the bulk of the manufacturing cost for the whole unit is in that plate (and installing it). It would be senseless to offer that piece as a separate repair part, if it breaks, you just would get a new mast receiver assembly, it take the same amount of time to replace just that plate as it would the whole mast receiver (labor wise at the dealer). As a side benefit by replacing the whole receiver, you are also replacing the real high stress component that actually does stress out and break down over time, which is the brass bushing holding the 1/4 inch stud (I've broken a couple of those).
Just my 2 cents
Bob

All valid points.

I'm all about spending the money on extra parts for long vacations and getting the part that breaks rather than the whole enchilada just makes it easier to pack & carry. I've taken out the plates a few times. 1/4" drive ratchet with a really long extension and a phillips head on the end, we're advised to check these screws periodically anyway.
Just seems like so many more screws.

If the only way to get the 1/4" base stud AND the Mast Pin is to buy the whole cup assemble then I guess Hobie has me over a barrel

If Hobie will warranty a 4 year old mast cup that's great news, except for part about trying to be proactive about keeping spare parts on hand. In all this I worry one day the brass bushing imbedded in the hull is going to fail.

Bob,
I have to disagree. To remove the mast pin base plate all you have to do is unscrew the 4 screws using a vey long screw driver. To replace the receiver is a lot more work and you have to remove the v- brace socket screw which has awkward access especially after they changed the set screw from a Hex key to a slot head.
I was surprised at how simple the mast pin base plate screws were to undo. I hadn't touched them for around 4 years. I replaced the screws soon after getting my TI because Hobie had not used loctite during assembly and I lost one very early on.
The loctite I used held them tight all that time, yet allowed for their removal without too much effort.

Is there a consensus that this pin failure is due to fatigue caused by the mast flexing? During tacks the opposing side loads must be considerable.

I agree. It's much more convenient to just carry the base plate as a spare. I've had no issues with the mast receiver.

Matt,
Is this the same part on AI/TI's and do you have figures on how many have failed?
If this is a fatigue issue then as time goes on there are bound to be more needing to be replaced.

Bob,
I've just re read your post and what you are saying is totally incorrect as far as I know.
You cannot replace the brass bushing that holds the 1/4" stud. It is molded into the hull and is not part of the receiver assembly. There would also be a big difference in labor costs re swapping out just the base plate (4 screws) or replacing the whole receiver assembly which from memory involves removing the x-bar and loosening/ readjusting the v-brace, removing the socket screw and all the receiver screws.
Have I got what you have said wrong? If so, please set me straight.

Stringy:
Ok here I am with egg on my face....
I was going from memory on how the mast receiver goes together without actually looking at it, and making too many creative assumptions about manufacturing without actually going back out to the garage and double checking things that I worked on 3-4 yrs ago without a further thought since then (haven't had any problems in that area since then).
First off you are correct there is no brass insert in the bottom of this mast receiver as I described. Here is a pic of one of my old mast recievers.


I distinctly remember rebuilding a piece that had a brass bushing, and the area around the bushing was all crushed and split about 4 yrs ago on one of my TI's, apparently it was not the bottom of the mast receiver that broke on me (I've ripped out several of those studs, and have had to repair that area in the boat a few times in the past). Obviously I don't remember what the exact problem was or what I did to repair it correctly.

You are also correct that the mast receiver does not have to be removed from the boat in order to replace the plate, working from my flawed memory, I was thinking the plate was screwed in from the bottom (not the top), so mistakenly stated the mast receiver has to be removed anyway, which is incorrect also.
It's funny how you memory can play tricks on you (unfortunately your memory is the second thing to go as you get older (LOL)). But I do distinctly remember repairing a severely elongated hole (the one the 1/4" stud goes thru) that had a brass bushing in it, where the area around the bushing was crushed and in pieces on one of my older hulls, looking back at it now, it must have been the brass insert in the hull itself (not the mast receiver). Too many TI's and repairs ago I guess.
Knowing my steels very well I am still willing to bet that on the thousands of Islands out there you can count the number of failed pins on one hand, and if you were to trace the actual failure cause, it would be flaws in the material itself rather than from some fatigue factor, where if it were a material fatigue factor eventually they will all snap off (I doubt highly this to be the case).
How Hobie handles stocks replacement parts is entirely up to them, being from manufacturing myself I know how expensive it is to maintain huge inventories of repair parts, and it is likely the sub assembly is supplied complete to hobie from a sub contractor. It is also likely Hobie does not own the tooling for these sub components and has little control over them ( they are likely buying a complete assembly from the sub-contractor, as one catalog number). That's pretty much how the world works these days.
I'm guessing that if a dealer reports a warranty repair because of a broken pin, they will receive from Hobie a complete mast receiver, where once they get it, they would remove the plate from the new unit, screw it into the old existing unit, then throw the rest of the parts away, that's pretty much how almost all manufacturing works today. On your car if you blow up a 3 cent resister on the computer motherboard, you get charged two grand for another computer which just plugs into the car, and the old one is thrown away, pretty much the same with TV's (I used to be a TV repairman LOL).

Stringy, you are entirely correct.
Bob

Bob,
No worries mate. Thanks for clearing that up. My memory plays tricks as well, which is why I wasn't sure I had it right.
I've always appreciated your honesty and your willingness to go out of your way to help others on this forum.
Thanks for your insights into the manufacturing/molding side of things as well. I know nothing about these things.
As these pin failures seem rare you may well be right about manufacturing flaws.
I've just been speaking to my dealer and he hasn't heard anything back from Hobie AU yet. There was a big Hobie comp interstate in WA on the weekend so the factory has been concentrating on that.
Hopefully I'll hear something in the next few days as things get back to normal.

Back in the office.......getting to it now!
Steve

_________________
Steve Fields
Hobie Cat Australasia
Huskisson NSW Australia
http://www.hobiecat.com.au

Well Hobie's legendary support has once again been shown to be the best out there.
After a quick phone call to check progress on this issue Steve Fields is sending the part directly to me!
Thanks Steve and Hobie. I wasn't expecting it to be warrantied as the TI is 4 years old but Hobie are sending it free of charge.
How good is that?!!!

The part arrived today and I reinstalled it OK ...apart from a few anxious moments when half a cotton bud taped to a long screwdriver I was using to dry/clean the screw holes got stuck! Managed to get it out using a very small self tapping screw in the hollow cotton bud stick.
Here is the replacement part. Note the under cutting caused by the welding of the pin. Possible reason for a fatigue failure???
The welding on the original failed pin looks finer/neater. The break was just above that weld line. I guess I'll check it in another 4 years!



Thanks Steve and Hobie AU as I was only out of action for a week!