TI Jib

Tony try removing everything inside the bracketed words except RczXCgrVGZY.

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...mark...

Enjoying a 2012 TI
w/ hakas, a stainless steel
mast topper & furling jib

After seeing that video: note to self 'if I see a bunch of wind surfers dropping like flies as seen in the video (in the background), then it's likely too windy for my TI' (for me anyway).
FE

Thank you! I get it now.

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Tony Stott
2012 Tandem Island "SIC EM" with Hobie spinnaker

Mast Topper: Checking out interest...

After trying and failing to make my own mast topper, I designed, then worked a company in Japan where I live, to develop a mast topper for myself. It is made of stainless steal, rotates effortlessly on two stainless steal bearings and now after a little modification, works great. The manufacturing company has offered to make more for about $400 each. After transportation and shipping costs, the price would be around US$450. Dollar yen fluctuation affects price too. It is more pricey than a home built, for sure, but professional and customizable. Different folks - different strokes. If more than just a couple of people are interested, I am guessing I could get a discount.

I am not and don't intend to get into business selling these things, but would be willing to be the in between guy if it would help someone. A person in Spain saw mine somewhere and requested one which I recently sent off.

Options:
Jib only design with or without aft stay option.
Jib and spinnaker combination with side supports and back stay. It can easily be modified to extend past the first batten if desired.
Spinnaker only - I would recommend Hobie's kit.

Anyway, if interested, please let me know. If interested but at a different price point, that would be helpful information too. Maybe to keep this thread cleaner, a PM would be the better way to go. Or I can start a new thread. Any suggestions are welcome...

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...mark...

Enjoying a 2012 TI
w/ hakas, a stainless steel
mast topper & furling jib

FWIW, Hobie is selling the "Mast Tip Rotator" from the Spinnaker kit as a separate item for $39. I think the part number is 79503101.

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/Robin
2016 TI Hibiscus
Amish spray skirts/trampolines
Northern Tool 4X48 utility trailer (modified)

An alternative you might want to consider instead of making a jib, buy a used jib. mastheadsailinggear.com has a big inventory of small cheap sails. Materials to make one might cost more than these used jibs. I've seen some pretty small jibs there that might fit a TI. Just put the luff length you want into their search engine.

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R/Thom
SeaRail 19
Triak
BMW C600
Formerly Getaway with Custom Spinnakers
Formerly raced F24 Mk II

I JUST bought a jib from them earlier this week and received it yesterday. They had quite a few contenders and ended up getting one made by North Sails from a "2.4 Meter". I finished up my furler and bow brace earlier this week and installed the jib last night. I would have liked to have done a little more "driveway sailing" last night but it was getting late when I finished. So if my mods don't blow up on me, I plan on testing it all out on the water today!

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-- Chad | 2014 TI

Looking forward to hearing how the jib works out Chad. Perfect day. You have winds in the 7-10mph range today which should be ideal for a test sail.

Note if you take in any extra water.

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Greg

2016 AI - Spinn & Jib

“Out of sight of land the sailor feels safe. It is the beach that worries him.”
– Charles G. Davis

So, I did my first day of testing out the jib. The winds ended up being mostly, very light and all over the place, so it was hard to determine if the jib helped much. The rigging all worked out well, but I definitely have some tweaks to make.

The day started out with no, to very little wind. I had very bad lee helm, but the jib SEEMED to give me a boost when motor sailing. There were a few bursts of wind and periods of actual sailing. During these bursts, pointing was bad but the helm actually felt balanced. The luff of the jib had a bad shape due to lack of a real fore stay, which I'm guessing was the reason for the bad pointing. Are you guys really cranking down on the halyard to get the fore stay nice and tight? I had mine very snug but not cranked down.

Overall, it was fun having another sail to mess with, and I did a little bit of wing on wing which was pretty cool.

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-- Chad | 2014 TI

The tension on the luff can make or break the performance of the jib. Like tpdavis says, the cut of the jib will determine what shape the luff should take.

I went back to my sail maker and found out that my jib was designed for power not pointing. This means my luff should be more curved, opening the jib to the wind. Jibs built for pointing will have a tighter, straight lined luff. We discussed the benefits of both and came to the conclusion that a jib with a lot of camber (designed for speed/power) made more sense for a small multihull. End result is you get to your making faster.

You really won't know about your jib until you have a chance to test it out in higher winds. Then vary the tension on the luff and leach until you get familiar with what works for this jib. Relax the clew in light winds for more speed and bring it in tighter in higher winds and when pinching. That will help prevent backwinding of the jib (luff flipping back towards you).

Also watch the foward 1/3 of the main for cupping which is due to backwinding of the main from the jib forcing too much air onto the main's backside. Too much backwinding of the main and you will slow down. Ease the jib out to the point where the cup in the main is gone or hardly noticable and you will feel the boat take off with more speed.

Monohulls point better than multihulls and jibs designed for pointing vs power I think are better suited for monohulls. May as well go for the power and design a jib to maximize that. At least that my understanding.

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Greg

2016 AI - Spinn & Jib

“Out of sight of land the sailor feels safe. It is the beach that worries him.”
– Charles G. Davis

Chadbach,

What size jib did you mount?

On top of the deck the TI mast goes 17' up, and to the prow is 4'4". The mast tip rotator will consume an inch or so to the halyard so the max luf is under 17.25'. So from http://www.mastheadsailinggear.com/product/19360/ something like this:

Luff Leech Foot LP SMW Condition Cloth Wt Luff Style Foot Style Sailmaker Boat
15.7 15.7 5.0 5.0 Fair 4oz Dacron Wire w/Twist Hanks

... I'm thinking might fit the boat. Though I'd be interested in the dimensions of what you mounted on your boat.

/Robin

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/Robin
2016 TI Hibiscus
Amish spray skirts/trampolines
Northern Tool 4X48 utility trailer (modified)

Most jibs are not made to take forestay loads, they are usually made to hank onto a forestay or slide onto a forestay. If you make or buy a jib that is meant to be hanked on, you probably would be best served to add something that can take most (not all) the load. With the tiny loads we create on these boats, you don't need much in the way of a real forestay, but if you have some 1/8 or 3/16 inch dacron or polyester line or kevlar kite string it might make sense to install it along the luff just a tiny bit longer than the actual luff so as the luff stretches it will stop stretching when it reaches the limit of the additional line. That will help a lot to give you a tight luff. When I make headsails (either jibs or asymspinnakers), I typically put in such a line to reinforce the leading edge. The snuffing jib I use has one and the hand tension I use to hoist it is sufficient to give good shape to weather. I sewed mine inside the luff hem/tape, but you could just tie it off between the head grommet and the tack grommet and achieve the same result.

As an off-topic issue, if you want to point higher, you can change your mainsail to a pin top. Yah, it removes some power, but it improves pointing a lot. I did that on my Triak since my courses are nearly always upwind and downwind and sometimes against a big current, it is more beneficial to me to point than go a tiny bit faster on a reach. That being said, no trimaran is going to point very well.

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R/Thom
SeaRail 19
Triak
BMW C600
Formerly Getaway with Custom Spinnakers
Formerly raced F24 Mk II

That's the way my jib was built. It has a 3/16 in line within the luff and is meant to be hoisted by hand using a halyard. This works fine on a dingy.

Tpdavis I appeciate your input on this forum. It obvious you have a lot of experience and knowledge about all this.

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Greg

2016 AI - Spinn & Jib

“Out of sight of land the sailor feels safe. It is the beach that worries him.”
– Charles G. Davis

That is good to know. Great price - much better than $400+. Has anyone tried this with just a jib? If so, I am curious how it would be rigged.

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...mark...

Enjoying a 2012 TI
w/ hakas, a stainless steel
mast topper & furling jib

This is the one I went with - http://www.mastheadsailinggear.com/product/19335/
13' luff, 11.7' leech, 5.5' foot. There's still room between it and the top of the mast, so a taller sail should fit. I just went with a shorter sail to help keep the square footage down.

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-- Chad | 2014 TI