Hobie's answer to the Slayer Propel?

I Want to start out by saying that this isn't a Native vs Hobie post, and it is not a discussion that I want to start.

I have owned a 2012 PA, a 2015 PA, and a 2015 Outback, and I believe that they are the ultimate kayak fishing machines. However, I just bought a 2015 Slayer Propel 13, and to be honest, I don't hate it. That said, the Hobies are superior in most ways except for a portable, comfortable platform. Hold on, hear me out.

The PA is, without question, more comfortable to sit in, and it allowed me to bring, pretty much, anything that I wanted to, and still gave me plenty of room to spare. However, in my opinion, it is almost more in a boat category, than a kayak when on land. I don't think that this is any kind of secret right? Like I said, I have owned 2 of them, and had a trailer for both of them, and they were still a pain to deal with on land.

The answer to those problems is a "newer" OB right? Well, I agree and disagree. The seat is still comfortable, and while it is stable enough to stand, it isn't exactly easy to stand and fish, and it's not very roomy while sitting. Again, I'm definitely not hating on the OB, it is a fantastic kayak in and out of the water.

On to why I bought the Native. I swore off peddle drive kayaks when I sold my last PA, as I just didn't use it enough to justify the price of it. (Small kids). Fast forward a year, and my fishing partner decides he has the kayak bug again, and had been looking at kayaks. We had both agreed that we would not jump into Hobies until we were fishing on a regular basis. We started looking at used paddle yaks, and convinced ourselves that if we bought kayaks that were not totally geared at fishing, we would actually use then to kayak. Well, he decided to just go ahead and buy another PA, because why not.

I was still completely against a peddle yak, until another friend bought an older Outback. So, I couldn't be the only one without peddles, but I did not want to swallow the Hobie price tag, and I genuinely wanted to be able to use my new plastic as a paddle kayak. To keep from rambling further than I have, I wound up demoing and buying a used Slayer Propel.

The Slayer paddles excellent, and the Propel drive isn't the absolute worst thing in the world, but it is completely worthless in shallow water, and the Mirage drive is better in every way except reverse (which I liked more than I thought I would). It is very stable to stand and fish, walk to the front hatch, turnaround and grab something from behind me, dance a jig, etc... The seat is wide and comfortable, and even though the height is not adjustable, I didn't feel any need to adjust it when paddling or peddling. I feel that I have plenty of room, and while I like the H-Bar better, I do like the rail system on the Slayer.

So, in summary, my ultimate question is really for Hobie themselves. Are there possible future plans to build a platform that is in between the OB and the PA? The Slayer 13 platform is the perfect compromise, in my opinion, when it comes to the size, stabliity, and dry land portability. The OB is great, but just a little small/cramped at times, and the PA is great, but too big for dry land.

Thoughts from the gallery?

TL;DR .........
Will Hobie make a fishing platform that is a compromise between the OB and the PA to put Native out of business?

Having had a couple of Pro anglers, you're certainly in a good position to evaluate the Slayer and if you prefer it, that's great. It's nice to have a choice. I had a Slayer 13 Propel as well and came to a little different conclusion, but it's good to have an open mind in such matters. We all have different priorities and needs. The Slayer should be compared with an Outback, since they are both kayaks, more or less. PAs, on the other hand, are more like Jonboats -- larger, heavier, roomier, and superior for standing.

I bought a new 2016 Native Propel slayer 13 last year and agree that the Propel has a couple of advantages over the Outback. It is more stable and easier to stand in with more foot room. The seat is certainly comfortable and has a nice adjustment range for long/short legs, although not nearly as versatile as the new Hobie Vantage seat. On the other hand, it is quite difficult and time consuming to install the seat on its rails -- the mounting screws are too wide for the mounts, depending on the temperature. Seat mount sagging seemed to be a problem for some owners, although I didn't experience it.

I noticed right away the Native bungees were of cheaper quality than Hobie's -- a small point but indicative of build quality. There were no hatches for in-hull storage except the small hole behind the seat with the rubber lid. Likewise, there was no emergency flotation, so the Slayers are not certified by the National Marine Manufacturer's Association. There seems to be an ongoing rudder problem -- the steering cable breaks frequently and is one of several items not covered by the manufacturer's Warranty. Speaking of warranty, It's only valid for the original purchaser and only if the boat is registered by the buyer within 2 weeks; warranty claims must be processed through the original dealer.

I found the Propel drive to be heavy (19 lbs) and noisy. There was no speed at which the drive would cease its constant whirring noise. It probably wouldn't have been so noticeable except I was accustomed to the quiet Mirage Drive. The pedaling action itself was much less comfortable for me, especially pushing through the "dead zone" at cruise speed. The thwart tube (part of the Propel mounting system) occasionally cracks and is not always covered by the warranty. The prop fouls easily in sea grass and can seize entirely.

Performance and handling with the Slayer propel 13 was not that great for me. My fastest one hour distance was 3.94 miles under calm conditions, no current. The rudder needed constant correction to maintain course. By comparison, my fastest hour with the Outback was 4.04 miles with standard fins and 4.54 miles with Turbofins. With the large rudder, very little course correction was necessary. Additionally, the Mirage Drive was much easier on my knees after an hours worth of pedaling. For anyone who cares, the Slayer got up to 3.4 MPH backwards and the Outback reached 5.4 MPH -- probably faster than anybody would realistically go. The Slayer's turn radius is satisfactory, once underway, but rudder authority is not great. Native offers no larger alternative. There are a couple of aftermarket larger rudders but they are expensive and void the warranty (for what that's worth).

The Slayer doesn't come with a paddle or paddle holder, so I had to supply my own. But, the Slayer did track better than the Outback (paddling). Additionally, the Outback "pushes" water at speed and slaps with any kind of chop -- the Slayer hull is quieter.

In short, the 2016 Slayer cost more than a 2016 Outback (even with upgraded rudder and fins), came with less equipment (no hatches, no pockets, no paddle or mount), was heavier, slower, not NMMA certified, and had a crappy warranty. Until Hobie's MD 180 came out, the Propel's reverse was a significant feature for some fishermen, but that's not the case any more.

In the end I sold it. IMO, its best feature was the "Lizard Lick" green color. Otherwise, it just didn't compare with the Hobies at all for me.

Having said all that, my recent Propel was MUCH improved over it's original version (which I demoed in 2008) and I hope they continue to evolve in a positive direction. Hopefully you'll get a lot of good use out of your Slayer!

I think the PA12 is the in-between OB and PA14. And there is only so much Hobie can do in terms of in-betweens before there is so much overlap that they are no longer cost effective.

I own an Outback and a PA14, but once I bought an Adventure Island, those two began gathering dust. The additional speed and distance the AI offers make it, in my opinion, a better overall fishing platform. Having said that, a shorter AI in maybe a 13 or 14 foot length with perhaps 40 square feet of sail might just be the answer to a smaller, faster, more capable fishing kayak that can still be easily car-topped or stowed in the back of a pick-up truck.

Roadrunner
I agree with everything that you said, and want to reiterate that I think Hobie is superior in every way, except for an in-between size yak. The reason I made this post is because I really want the mirage drive back, but I do not want to lug around the PA again, and the Outback just doesn't have the room I want. (Notice I said want, not need)

Tom
I have looked at the PA 12, and almost bought one before the last PA 14 that I bought. Maybe you're right about it being the go between of the OB and PA, but right now, I disagree. While the 12 is 15lbs lighter than the 14, it is 20lbs heavier than the Propel, and 3in wider. I won't believe it until I try it that it will paddle well, and I still think it will be hard to maneuver on land.

I"m no bodybuilder by any means, but I'm in pretty decent shape, and stronger than most, I think. I can flip the Propel on it's side and carry it with one arm without hating life. I'm not sure I could say the same about the PA 12, and I would tie a rope to my Polaris and drag the 14 before thinking about carrying it. However, you have sparked my interest in the 12, and I think that I will revisit it very soon.

Did you know that the Hobie scupper cart fits the Propel?

Being lazy, I don't like to strain unnecessarily. With the cart, you can wheel it into the water and extract the cart; If you carry it on board, you can insert it before removing the boat from the water and roll it (loaded) right up to your vehicle. The tennis balls are to cushion around the scupper holes
To take this a step further, depending on your transport vehicle, there is always an easier way to make things work. If you have a truck with a 6' bed, you can roll the PA 14 right up to the tailgate and shove it in by lifting the back only.


Or with a hitch and a bed extender (especially with a shorter bed) you can do it this way:


Tall truck -- need more height? How about some Walmart $30 ramps (I haven't actually tried it)?


If you're loading overhead, you can set one end on your rack:


Then lift the stern and shove -- no need to lift more than half.


Here's a detail of the Thule glide pads fit. A Hobie cradle would probably be better yet.


If you have a car or SUV, there are rack extenders and side extensions to still use this technique. Or you can use a hitch and t-bar:


Regarding your desire for a boat between the Outback and PA 12. there are already 3 Hobies in the 12 - 14' range that specialize in fishing so a forth might be overkill. If you like to stand and the PA 12 is still too bulky for your taste, there is always the Oasis -- faster, lighter, tons of room for gear and/or guests, stand-up stable and paddlable! It's the most versatile Hobie in the fleet IMO.


If not, the Slayer may be the best overall fit for you after all!