2013 PA12 rudder mount frozen

Hi all,
New user here. I just bought a used 2013 PA12 and the rudder mount is frozen in it’s sleeve. I looked through the forums and couldn’t find my problem.

I opened up the rudder cover. I have the older version where the rudder drum is attached by a rolled pin. I removed the pin and drum and I expected the rudder to slide out. (The rudder up/down cable was released). I can barely spin the rudder by hand, grasping it firmly from below. I can get it to turn about a quarter turn. I have sprayed penetrating oil and I have hit the top of the shaft with a hammer but it won’t move. I’m afraid to hit it too hard for fear of pushing the brass sleeve right out of the plastic. It is my understanding that the kayak has not been used for 3 years so I’m assuming there is some rust and I’ll need a new mount. The problem is, I can’t replace it if I can’t remove the old one.

Thanks for your help!

I have a 2013 PA-14 and my rudder assembly should be the same as your PA-12....suggest using Kroil penetrating oil and let it sit over night....
The stainless steel shaft should come free from the brass sleeve by twisting as you have tried.

Once the shaft is out, you can clean/polish it up with a fine emery paper.

When reinstalling, suggest lubricating/using waterproof trailer wheel bearing grease on the shaft.

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Dr.SteelheadCatcher
Warrenton, OR

Hi Doc,
Thanks for your response. For $30, I plan on replacing the rudder mount once I can get the old one out. Also planning on greasing it well. Hopefully the penetrating oil will do its job. I’ve been trying to figure out what could possibly be holding it in place. It seems that the stainless steel of the rudder mount is of decent quality and I was trying to figure out if there was a burr that might have caused a groove in the brass sleeve. I’m at a loss on how to get it out. As far as as I can tell, there is nothing in the design that would keep it from sliding out, so it must be rust or something else jamming the shaft in the sleeve. Hopefully, the oil we get it to release. I’m just too impatient to give it time to work!! I bought the thing, I just want to use it and the weather is beginning to turn... I was thinking of hanging 10lbs of weight on the rudder to help gravity do its thing. I’m resisting hitting it hard with a hammer because I’m really afraid of separating the sleeve from the plastic of the hull. I’ve been using PB Blaster. If it doesn’t work, I’ll try using Kroil.

Well rain has slowed down working on the rudder. We used clay to create an oil reservoir around the rudder shaft. Left it all last night and today with no change. We’ve ordered the Kroil and we’ll try that when it gets here. I have a dealer that is local to me, but it just feels like something I should be able to fix on my own, unless they have some kind of special “gear puller” type tool that can pull the shaft through the sleeve without pulling the sleeve out of the hull. I’ll keep you updated on progress. Still looking for any creative ideas that will help me unfreeze this. I’m wondering if heating the shaft would get the oil to flow better. Heating will make the shaft expand which will only make it tighter (at least until it cools down). I’m really drawing at straws...

I agree that heating the shaft will damage/soften the plastic.....not good.

If you have not already done so, suggest removing the plastic rudder......it tales a Phillips head on one side and a slotted blade screw driver on the other side.......a right angle drive might be required.

A couple of ideas that come to my simple mind:

How about something like a mini-pickle fork that can be used underneath to pull the shaft out of the bushing?

Or maybe a c-clamp with a tapered wedge on each side that would pull the shaft out of the bushing??
The wedge could be like the steel axe handle wedges used to tighten the head on the wooden handle......if you can get a small space between the rudder housing and the base of the bushing, you could then insert a screwdriver blade and twist the blade to move/pull the shaft. A vice grip clamped on the shaft of the screw drive can give you plenty of twisting power.

Good luck!

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Dr.SteelheadCatcher
Warrenton, OR

Well the Kroil arrived today. My friend and I put some on the shaft. Since I am impatient, we started working on it right away rather than let it sit. Holy crap! Within 10 seconds the rudder mount started to loosen up! We tapped with a hammer pulled and swiveled from the bottom, we have almost all of it out and my arms are ready to fall off so now I’m letting it soak. Thanks for the recommendation to use Kroil. That stuff is unbelievable! Even though it’s not all of the way out yet, at least I know it’s going to come out.

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Dr.SteelheadCatcher
Warrenton, OR

Well even after using Kroil, we couldn’t get the rudder mount shaft out of the bushing. While working on it the bushing actually came out of the hull. I found a post titled “Rudder tightness” dated 7-20-14 that you actually commented on. Matt Miller responded to it and said that the rudder is seized and to contact the dealer for a warranty claim. I guess that’s my next step.

Just an update on my progress. I emailed Matt Miller and he had someone call me. They have redesigned the rudder mount and brass sleeve so there is now a plastic sleeve that sits between the rudder mount and the brass bushing. That means that I can’t get a replacement for my bushing. I was told that it will go back into place no problem. I needed to clean up the old bushing which I did with my Dremel and a grinding wheel that fit perfectly into the bushing. I ordered a new rudder mount. It has also been redesigned as of 2014. The dealer didn’t know that when you replace a 2013 rudder mount, you also have to replace the steering drum. The drum doesn’t come with the screw to mount it so you need to either order it from Hobie or pick up a #10-30x3/8 stainless machine screw from Home Depot. I now have all the parts and it should take 15 minutes to put it back together. Hope this helps anyone who has the same problem.